Need some advice on "NO START" troubleshooting 5.7 MerCruiser

[jjack010]

99 Hurricane 232 deckboat w/ 5.7 MerCruiser

I bought the boat from original owners early this year. Very well maintained boat. I have all service records. New motor was installed last year and only has roughly 30 hrs on it.

We had it out one month ago. Ran it for 2 days without any issues.

I was out of town for work so it sat for one month. Its docked in a slip on the water. There was some standing water in the hull (engine compartment) but not enough to concern me.

Now it won't start. At one point it tried to turn over, got maybe one slow revolution then sound like it met resistance. Now I only get the click from the solenoid.

Battery is charged. Terminals are clean. Good power to slave solenoid. Beat on the starter with a hammer. I called a mobile marine mechanic, he initially said it was the starter. Then he tried to spin the motor with a cheap 3/8 small ratchet and it wouldn't turn. New diagnosis was engine is seized. Most of the boat ramps are closed so getting it out will be a pain.

He pulled the plugs and said #6 had 4 cups of water. New diagnosis is riser gaskets blown or rain water got in it somehow.

I was not there when he pulled the plugs but looked at them today. They all look great. If the #6 cylinder was full of water wouldn't there be rust on the bottom of the spark plug?

I am not a marine mechanic but am mechanically knowledgeable. I just don't want to be throwing my money away here. Any advice is helpful. Thanks in advance.

 

[bobkat1864]

He tried to turn the engine over with a 3/8 ratchet? Ok, well it sounds more like bad connections at the starter, or maybe a bad starter to me. I would recommend cleaning up the connections on the starter, and the ground at the block, then trying to crank her over with all the plugs out...see if she will turn and if any water comes out of any of the plug holes. So many no starts are caused by bad connections, so hopefully maybe that is all it is. It's a place to start, and good luck.

 

[turbocorrado]

also pretty sure 4 cups of water dont fit in any single cylinder

 

[jjack010]

also pretty sure 4 cups of water dont fit in any single cylinder

Oh, did I mention I had a 572 crate motor in it? Just kidding!

 

[jjack010]

He tried to turn the engine over with a 3/8 ratchet? Ok, well it sounds more like bad connections at the starter, or maybe a bad starter to me. I would recommend cleaning up the connections on the starter, and the ground at the block, then trying to crank her over with all the plugs out...see if she will turn and if any water comes out of any of the plug holes. So many no starts are caused by bad connections, so hopefully maybe that is all it is. It's a place to start, and good luck.

Ok. I'll go back through all the connections and follow-up. Is there an easy way to get to the starter in this mofo? I had to damn near put lube on my arm to get it down the side just to snap a pic of the connections. LOL

 

[Bt Doctur]

Depending on the water level it could have taken out the starter ,so start by removing all the plugs and turning it over with the key. If there is no response from the starter it most likely went under and needs replacement
Depending on what you fine with the plugs out ,report back
NEVER USE A WRENCH ON THE CRANK BOLT
In some cases the motors come out to replace the starters, sometimes removing the manifold give a bit of extra room.

 

[jjack010]

Depending on the water level it could have taken out the starter ,so start by removing all the plugs and turning it over with the key. If there is no response from the starter it most likely went under and needs replacement
Depending on what you fine with the plugs out ,report back
NEVER USE A WRENCH ON THE CRANK BOLT
In some cases the motors come out to replace the starters, sometimes removing the manifold give a bit of extra room.

Yes, this is exactly what my initial thought was. I expected the mechanic to show up and want to confirm my suspicion of the starter being seized since it may have gotten wet or worse, submerged.

 

[bobkat1864]

Ok. I'll go back through all the connections and follow-up. Is there an easy way to get to the starter in this mofo? I had to damn near put lube on my arm to get it down the side just to snap a pic of the connections. LOL

When the starter went on my boat, I was faced with the same predicament as you are, no room to get to it. I ended up removing one of the built in rear seat to access it, and it still was a bit of a squeeze. Good luck and let us know how you make out.

 

[burtonrider11]

I had to replace the starter on our 97 5.7l. The motor sits down in the hull just a bit. I had to remove the rear bench seat to get good access to it. I discovered after getting the bolts out that the old starter wouldn't come out - not enough room. I ended up removing the manifold to get some more clearance. It definitely helped, though it still wasn't easy. Hopefully you'll have a bit more clearance. I pulled our boat into the garage and supported the elbow from the rafters above, this way, I only had to remove the manifold itself. It's heavy, but pretty easy, 4 bolts hold the manifold, one bolt facing forward holds the drive lube reservoir. You will most likely have to remove the water hose at the bottom. You may want to have a gasket set on hand as well to replace the old ones if they don't come off cleanly.

My only advice is to really torque down the starter bolts when re-installing. I didn't and ended up snapping off one of the old bolts in the block. That was a whole nother adventure. However, after replacing the starter and 2 new starter bolts, she starts like a champ again!

Also, when I bought my bolts from ARP, the tech I talked to said to oil the heads and threads, he said it really helps seat the bolts better as there is less friction where the shoulder meets the starter and can help with corrosion/removal at a later time. I have no idea if it really makes a difference however, those bolts are in there good now Good luck with your project

 

[jjack010]

I had to replace the starter on our 97 5.7l. The motor sits down in the hull just a bit. I had to remove the rear bench seat to get good access to it. I discovered after getting the bolts out that the old starter wouldn't come out - not enough room. I ended up removing the manifold to get some more clearance. It definitely helped, though it still wasn't easy. Hopefully you'll have a bit more clearance. I pulled our boat into the garage and supported the elbow from the rafters above, this way, I only had to remove the manifold itself. It's heavy, but pretty easy, 4 bolts hold the manifold, one bolt facing forward holds the drive lube reservoir. You will most likely have to remove the water hose at the bottom. You may want to have a gasket set on hand as well to replace the old ones if they don't come off cleanly.

My only advice is to really torque down the starter bolts when re-installing. I didn't and ended up snapping off one of the old bolts in the block. That was a whole nother adventure. However, after replacing the starter and 2 new starter bolts, she starts like a champ again!

Also, when I bought my bolts from ARP, the tech I talked to said to oil the heads and threads, he said it really helps seat the bolts better as there is less friction where the shoulder meets the starter and can help with corrosion/removal at a later time. I have no idea if it really makes a difference however, those bolts are in there good now Good luck with your project

Great info. I appreciate it. So did the bolt break off due to tightening too much? Or the bolts were loose and one broke when the starter was engaged?

 

[burtonrider11]

Great info. I appreciate it. So did the bolt break off due to tightening too much? Or the bolts were loose and one broke when the starter was engaged?

No problem! I was afraid to torque them down too much when I installed the new starter. As such, they were slightly loose. I didn't realize this until it was too late

So if you can somehow get a torque wrench in there (I couldn't), I think you can set them to 40-50lb-ft. I just took mine and kept tightening them little by little. I have been checking them before we go out each time and so far they are snug.

 

[jjack010]

No problem! I was afraid to torque them down too much when I installed the new starter. As such, they were slightly loose. I didn't realize this until it was too late

So if you can somehow get a torque wrench in there (I couldn't), I think you can set them to 40-50lb-ft. I just took mine and kept tightening them little by little. I have been checking them before we go out each time and so far they are snug.

Makes me wonder if blue lock tight would be a good choice here. I'll have to take a look at the service manual and see what the torque specs are.

 

[jjack010]

I've been working some long hrs so I had the mechanic go back out today. I asked him to pull the starter and test. He said he bench tested it and it worked like a champ. Stated the motor still won't turn, starters removed and plugs removed. He recommended pulling the boat out of the water and continue troubleshooting at his shop. That's not an option anymore because all the boats ramps are closed due to the high water levels. I recommended him soaking the cylinders in a lubricating oil overnight and recheck tomorrow. I'll report back when complete.

I really don't like the fact that almost everything he's done has only been because of my recommendation. I'm no marine mechanic but seems like everything I've requested be done should be a part of the logical troubleshooting procedures. We'll see what tomorrow brings.

 

[bobkat1864]

Well, under normal circumstances I would recommend pulling the drive, because a locked up drive will prevent the engine from turning over. But since you can't pull the boat out of the water, removing the drive is pretty much out of the question. Absolutely no way to get her out of the water?

 

[jjack010]

Well, under normal circumstances I would recommend pulling the drive, because a locked up drive will prevent the engine from turning over. But since you can't pull the boat out of the water, removing the drive is pretty much out of the question. Absolutely no way to get her out of the water?

Can't pull it out at this point and there's rain in the forecast for a while.

You mentioned locked up drive..........There is a bunch of crud growing on the drive unit from sitting for the last month in the water unused. Doesn't look severe but any chance this could lead to my issue?

 

[bobkat1864]

Sure it is possible. Normal troubleshooting for a engine that won't turn over is to pull the drive, then try to turn the engine...a old output shaft is probably the best and safest way. As BT DR mentioned in a previous post, trying to turn the engine with the crankshaft nose bolt is very dangerous. If that bolt breaks off it is a really big pita. And shooting oil into all the spark plug holes is a great idea too...marvel mystery oil is a good choice. Just in case there is rust in there.

 

[jjack010]

I was just talking with the mechanic. He's confident there is water in the cylinders. Looks like next step is to remove water and soak in some oil. I can't get the boat out of the water to get the drive off anyway. With that being said, my next question would be how did the water get there. He mentioned that it could have been something as simple as the water splashing up on the hull during a storm and entering the engine. This is where my ignorance comes into play. It's a boat, how the hell would splashing water harm anything?! :lol:

 

[bobkat1864]

It's possible for water to enter the engine thru the intake...say if rainwater was to collect on top of the flame arrestor and then leak down into the engine thru the open intake valves. There are many other ways too. Looking into the cylinders with a bore scope will tell you what is really in there. If your mechanic does not own one, you may be able to loan or rent one from a parts store.

 

[FreeBeeTony]

Not sure where you're located, but if that was salt water and it sat for a month, it might be too late......

 

[jjack010]

Ok, learning the disadvantages of having it in a slip. Mechanic also asked if I had insurance yesterday. That's got me worried a bit. But, I do have insurance.