johnson 33hp water cold start steam

slx12001

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Hello, I have a new to me 1969 Johnson 33EL69A 33hp tiller motor on a plain jane 16ft alum boat. The motor started fine when I went to look at the boat. it was also pumping water ok. When I got home to do some tuning and change plugs, coils, points, condensers, and run new plug wire I noticed when I started it up cold it would not pump water for 30~45 seconds. The head will get to about 120+ degrees then water will start pumping with a cloud of smoke (steam?) as I asume the engine is warm. Then after about 15 seconds of water pumping ok with steam head temp quickly drops to 90~100 degrees. This is running in a large bucket 20+ gallons maby. I have used this bucket to run many outboards with out any issues. I'm not new to repairing old outboards but this no pump for 30~45 sec on cold motor then lots of steam for several seconds is new to me. It also does this when warm and restarted after sitting for more then a few minutes. If I restart in 1-2 minutes all is as it should be. Other then this the engine runs well. Any thoughts? Thanks.
 
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kodibass

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Just sounds like the t-stat opening to me, I have a 59 35 hp it does this also. Does yours have the twin water tubes? it seems to be fairly common on that set up. I have a 40 Lark it does this as well.
 

kfa4303

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

HI six. Welcome to iboats. I used to have a '66 33 hp myself. It used to pump water immediately upon start up in the water. The 33hp models were sort of de-tunned 35hp and usually do not have t-stats, so that shouldn't be an issue. I would double check the impeller to make sure that it is still in good shape and that all of the vanes are pointing in the same direction. I would also make sure that the copper water uptake tube is properly seated in both the underside of the motor and on to the top of the impeller housing. It can be a little tricky to get everything to align, but be patient and it will all come together. I would try to avoid running the motor at all if/when it stops pumping water. It would be a shame for it to overheat. Based on the "L" in the model number it looks like a longshaft model with a 20" leg length. Be sure that the anti-vent plate found just above the prop is level, or slightly higher than the keel of the boat. Here are some links that may help. As you can see in the vids, thes old motors don't produce a "pee stream" like modern motors, but instead eject the cooling water along with the exhaust gasses from the back of the motor. Don't be alarmed if the test tank water is gross after using. That's perfectly normal.

Reviving a Vintage Big Twin - Part 1
1969 Johnson 33EL69A 33 hp Outboard Motor Parts
Johnson 33 hp 33pk 1962 Seahorse - YouTube
Running1965 Evinrude 33HP Outboard Ski Twin E/Start Short Shaft Outboard W/ New Water Pump $425 - YouTube
 

slx12001

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Thanks for the replies. I figured it may have something to do with the impeller but didnt want to pull it all apart as the previous owner said the impeller was changed last year. I didnt see a t-stat in the breakdown. Last nignt it sat in the water bucket all night and when I started it today water was there in a couple of seconds so I dont know. If this is a detuned 35hp what is needed to up the ponies to 35? I rebuilt the carb today with an sierra kit as well. The needles looked ok so I cleaned everything out and installed a new needle/seat and float. It runs about the same as before the rebuild. One thing that I dont understand is that it seems to run best @ about 1 turn lsn and 1/2 turn hsn. I can get a good idle about 750 rpm. I would asume about 650-675 in gear on the water. My temp today was 75 degrees about 200ft above sea level. The rebuild kit stated way different carb settings. The needles are not real responsive either. (meaning that 1/8 turn does not seem to affect much either way when close. It does "chug" or quick miss once in a while. Not sure if it's common for this engine. (what ya think) Boy it's a Good thing the engine has the cut out switch as this thing runs away every time you cut the throttle. It seems like it's "lean hanging" Has anyone found a fix? It's deff an issue where it runs lean when you cut the throttle. An accelerator pump working when you cut the throttle would be a fix but would be interesting to hook up. What ya think about carb and tune? What are factory needle settings? What about the upgrade to 35hp? Thanks again.
 

slx12001

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

I forgot to mention compression is 114 116 now. What was stock compression for this engine? Thanks again.
 
Joined
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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

It is 33 ski twinn right try reving engine up when you start it up i bet water will come out fast mine is 40 skitwinn and it may be cloged a little try reving it up for a while then turn off and try again for some reason if the water is not coming out when you start rev it up if it dont come out first 3500rpms then it probly impeller after i cleaned mine out a few times it will shoot right out you may have idle low ive had to do that on a few motors rev high for just a sec to get the water there faster just try it cause pumps not primed so prime it faster
 

kfa4303

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

HI slx. They de-tunned the 35hp by removing parts like the t-stat and a few other bits to make it slightly more affordable, but they are otherwise a typical "Big Twin" OMC motor that was made for decades. It sounds like the carb isn't working properly. A turn 1/8-1/4 turn on either needle should have a noticeable effect on the idle. You want to make sure that the brass nuts the needles pass through are threaded just enough to provide friction on the needles themselves, but not so tight that they can't be adjusted. You also have to make sure that the packings are new and not damaged. As for the compression, that sound fine. Anything over 100 psi is good, and the spark sounds strong too, which only leaves fuel (i.e. carburetor and/or fuel pump). If the primer bulb gets and stays firm after squeezing, then the fuel pump is probably ok. However, if it fails to firm up, then the fuel pump is probably bad and will need to be replaced as that particular model is not rebuildable.
 

slx12001

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Thanks for the replies. I ended up checking the impeller. The guy said it was new last year. Funny guy. The blades were all there but were very weak. The last fella to have it apart also must have thought that red rtv was ok to use to seal back up. (basically no seal.) I put in a new wear plate, impeller housing, and impeller. Then used 487 to seal back up. This thing pumps in a few seconds and 2x as much water. I should have known better but wanted to believe the fella had "rebuilt" the water pump last year. again, Funny guy. KFA4303....So the 33hp is kinda like a spl 88 or other junnyrude that are really 90hp in the case of the slp 88 or 33-(35hp) just a lower end model without some of the bells and whistles? (No power tilt ect in the case of the spl 88) low end model. I really like how this Johnson 33hp runs. I had it idling at about 750 rpm in my tank for close to 45 minutes with some reves here and there and it didnt load up. I must say that a 6 gallon tank aint going to cut it. This thing is a gas hog. Anyway thanks again for the replies.
 
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kfa4303

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Glad you got her pumping water again slx! Yeah, OMC offered several "budget" versions of various models over the years, but there's little if any noticeable difference between a 33 and 35 aside from a few items like t-stats, badges, and some electrical accessories. I loved my old 33hp. Most reliable motor I've ever had. Not a huge amount of top end speed, but tons of low-end torque for getting up on plane. It did like to eat gas, but gas is still a lot cheaper than buying a new motor of equal power. Be sure to post some pics of yourself out on the water!
 

slx12001

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Thanks for the response. kfa4303...... I'm getting the throttle all back adjusted to factory specs and everything lined back up. My stator fully advances at about a little over 1/2 almost 3/4 throttle then stays advanced to full throttle. My line up mark cast into the intake is aligned with the indication mark on the cam. Is this about right for this engine? It seems to want to idle better with the timing a little advanced from the cast line up mark a few degrees past the cam mark. Is this about right for both? Thanks again.
 

kfa4303

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Hello again slx. Do a search here in the procedures called a "link and synch" which is a procedure for getting the spark and fuel delivery properly adjusted. The needles on the carb are used to adjust the fuel delivery, while the idle set screw at the base of the throttle tower to advance, or retard the spark. It takes some fiddling, but you should be able to dial in a nice idle.
 

slx12001

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Re: johnson 33hp water cold start steam

Thanks for the reply. It idles great. I know about the needle jets. I have actually been building engines for about 25 years. The last couple years I have been playing with old outboards as very few people in my area actually will work on them. (or correctly know how to as I found out the hard way when I paid a guy that "knew all about old outboards") From then on I decided to try and figure them out and have restored a few. I guess my question was more detailed as far as timing. My 33hp seems to run better at idle with a few degrees of timing asuming all eltse is correct. (I have no idea if it's a few more degrees then 0 or what as there is not info that I can find anywhere) (per my service manuals) I was wondering from a previous owner if this is common. I cant find how many degrees of timing the engines should have at any given rpm range. If say the engine likes 5 degrees at 900 rpm or x degrees at wot then I can calculate the rest. This would not take into account worn points that can cause the timing to actually retard. This would be with new points for a baseline. Thanks again for the replies.
 
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