1989 Johnson 25 HP Starter/Primer Solenoid Question

sr522re

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
Messages
42
So, my motor runs great, and I don't usually have issues starting it (other than having to mess with the primer solenoid switching between manual and automatic), but after reading a lot of posts about the primer solenoid I'm beginning to wonder if my starter itself is not operating correctly.

When I turn the key to the start position, my starter jumps right up and begins to turn the motor over, but only for about 1 to 2 seconds at most before disengaging even though I keep the key in the "start" position. So I turn the key off and back to the start position again and get another 1 to 2 second of the starter turning the motor over. I have to repeat this just a few times before the motor fires right up and runs fine. (All this with the primer solenoid in the manual positions after manually priming the fuel line bulb. Once the motor starts I switch the primer solenoid back to automatic.)

Is this normal for a starter? I would think that as long as the key is in the start position that the starter should be engaged and turning over the motor until I stop it with the key.

I'm wondering if my primer solenoid isn't functioning properly because my starter doesn't turn over long enough to create the necessary pressure for the solenoid to work properly?


Anyone able to follow this? :)

If anyone has any input I would certainly appreciate it.

Thank you in advance!
 

gm280

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Jun 26, 2011
Messages
14,585
Re: 1989 Johnson 25 HP Starter/Primer Solenoid Question

So, my motor runs great, and I don't usually have issues starting it (other than having to mess with the primer solenoid switching between manual and automatic), but after reading a lot of posts about the primer solenoid I'm beginning to wonder if my starter itself is not operating correctly.

When I turn the key to the start position, my starter jumps right up and begins to turn the motor over, but only for about 1 to 2 seconds at most before disengaging even though I keep the key in the "start" position. So I turn the key off and back to the start position again and get another 1 to 2 second of the starter turning the motor over. I have to repeat this just a few times before the motor fires right up and runs fine. (All this with the primer solenoid in the manual positions after manually priming the fuel line bulb. Once the motor starts I switch the primer solenoid back to automatic.)

Is this normal for a starter? I would think that as long as the key is in the start position that the starter should be engaged and turning over the motor until I stop it with the key.

I'm wondering if my primer solenoid isn't functioning properly because my starter doesn't turn over long enough to create the necessary pressure for the solenoid to work properly?

Anyone able to follow this? :)

If anyone has any input I would certainly appreciate it.

Thank you in advance!

NO that isn't normal at all. When you turn the key, your starter (via the starter solenoid) should engage as long as you have the key turned to the start position. So you either have a defective key switch or some wiring to the solenoid... Check with a volt meter to see that when you do turn the key to start that the starter solenoid is getting 12 volts at the small terminal...and it shouldn't drop out either. If it is, then your problem is either the solenoid itself or the starter...

And welcome to iboats :welcome:
 

Joe Reeves

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
13,262
Re: 1989 Johnson 25 HP Starter/Primer Solenoid Question

Are you attempting to start the engine with the primer solenoid in the manual (open) position because it is impossible to start it in the automatic position? You don't really say.

To check the solenoid for proper operation, trace one of the small hoses from the primer solenoid to the carburetor or intake manifold and remove it. Have the RED lever in the automatic position. Pump the fuel primer bulb up hard. Turn the key to the RUN position (engine NOT running) and push it in... fuel should shoot out that small hose. If it does, the solenoid is working properly.

Starting procedure: pump fuel bulb up hard, crank engine and push the key in at the same time. When the engine fires/starts, release the key so that it falls back to the run position.

The electric starter bendix gear jumping out of the flywheel... This is normally caused by a vast difference in compression between cylinders. The starter recognizes the pressure encountered by the cylinder with normal compression and stays engaged, BUT when the cylinder with the low compression is encountered, the starter is fooled into a scenario that the engine has fired and the bendix gear disengages.

You may have a bad head gasket or a serious engine internal problem. At any rate, check the compression and let us know what the readings are.

The early model V6 Loopers (even in perfect condition) had this problem design... it was impossible to check the compression on these models unless all of the spark plugs were installed. If they were removed, the bendix would kick out of the flywheel as soon as the piston passed top dead center of the cylinder that had the gauge stuck in it and moved onto the next cylinder that obviously had no compression.
 

sr522re

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
Messages
42
Re: 1989 Johnson 25 HP Starter/Primer Solenoid Question

NO that isn't normal at all. When you turn the key, your starter (via the starter solenoid) should engage as long as you have the key turned to the start position. So you either have a defective key switch or some wiring to the solenoid... Check with a volt meter to see that when you do turn the key to start that the starter solenoid is getting 12 volts at the small terminal...and it shouldn't drop out either. If it is, then your problem is either the solenoid itself or the starter...

And welcome to iboats :welcome:


Thank you GM280! I didn't think that was normal for my starter. I will definitely get a voltage reading at the starter and check all the wiring etc.
 

sr522re

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
Messages
42
Re: 1989 Johnson 25 HP Starter/Primer Solenoid Question

Are you attempting to start the engine with the primer solenoid in the manual (open) position because it is impossible to start it in the automatic position? You don't really say.

To check the solenoid for proper operation, trace one of the small hoses from the primer solenoid to the carburetor or intake manifold and remove it. Have the RED lever in the automatic position. Pump the fuel primer bulb up hard. Turn the key to the RUN position (engine NOT running) and push it in... fuel should shoot out that small hose. If it does, the solenoid is working properly.

Starting procedure: pump fuel bulb up hard, crank engine and push the key in at the same time. When the engine fires/starts, release the key so that it falls back to the run position.

The electric starter bendix gear jumping out of the flywheel... This is normally caused by a vast difference in compression between cylinders. The starter recognizes the pressure encountered by the cylinder with normal compression and stays engaged, BUT when the cylinder with the low compression is encountered, the starter is fooled into a scenario that the engine has fired and the bendix gear disengages.

You may have a bad head gasket or a serious engine internal problem. At any rate, check the compression and let us know what the readings are.

The early model V6 Loopers (even in perfect condition) had this problem design... it was impossible to check the compression on these models unless all of the spark plugs were installed. If they were removed, the bendix would kick out of the flywheel as soon as the piston passed top dead center of the cylinder that had the gauge stuck in it and moved onto the next cylinder that obviously had no compression.



Thank you Joe! Very interesting, and also a little confusing. I can't imagine I have an issue with the internals of the motor or a head gasket leak. It idles great and runs very strong. This little 25 hp can get my 16ft Tracker Pro V up to 25 mph without issue. It seems very reliable.

However, now that you mention it, I have had both plugs out before when winterizing and I seem to remember the starter being able to run constantly while holding the key in the start position. But only when the plugs are removed. When the plugs are installed the starter will only run for a second or two before disengaging. I do have a compression tool and I will certainly check that out and report back.

As far as the primer solenoid goes, you are correct. I have never been able to get the motor to start when the primer solenoid is in the auto position even when following the procedure you mentioned. I have to put the solenoid in manual mode, prime the system manually with the primer bulb, turn the key, and it fires right up. I then have to turn the solenoid back to auto or the motor will stall out after about 10 to 20 second.

I have never removed the fuel line from the solenoid before though to verify if gas comes out when I press the key in and the solenoid is in auto mode. I will check that at the same time when I check the compression of the motor and report back.

Thanks for all the good information! In the mean time, if you, are anyone else has anything more to offer I really appreciate the input.

I will try and report back this evening or tomorrow morning with my findings...
 
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