Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

[detox]

I have a Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 and after running good for the last two months it would not start. I just finish burning up 2 starters. I thought it would not turn over because the starter was bad. The 1st starter would no longer engage so, I replaced it. Put a new starter, a new solenoid and cleaned all connections. The starter would engaged but, it would not turn the flywheel. I kept cranking until the starter burned up. Now I think the starter was not the problem to begin with. In neutral the prop spins freely but, when I put in either forward or reverse it will not budge. Thursday I will pull the spark plugs to see if the flywheel/prop will move while in gear. Is there anything else I should check? I really hope I did not destroy my motor?.

Regards,

detox

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

You say at one point... "The starter would engage but, it would not turn the flywheel. I kept cranking until the starter burned up." This is somewhat confusing as the engine cannot be cranked if the starter would not turn the flywheel, however..................

Remove the spark plugs. Grab the flywheel with your hands or a socket & breaker bar and try to turn it. If you can't turn the flywheel, remove the lower unit and then try to turn the flywheel again.

If the flywheel will turn with the lower unit removed, the problem is within the lower unit and not the powerhead.

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

You say at one point... "The starter would engage but, it would not turn the flywheel. I kept cranking until the starter burned up." This is somewhat confusing as the engine cannot be cranked if the starter would not turn the flywheel, however..................

I apologize for not being clear. The starter would engage. After engaging the flywheel I kept the key turned but, it would not rotate the flywheel. The starter eventually got stuck in the up position I installed a new (used) starter this one would spin and not engage the flywheel. I then installed a brand new starter and a new solenoid that starter would engage but, not rotate the flywheel just like the original starter. Once it did not rotate the flywheel I stopped turning the key and decided take a look at the flywheel/prop. The prop spins freely in neutral and will not turn in gear. I am testing without the spark plugs tonight.

Thank you for your help,

detox

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

If you can't turn the flywheel by hand with the spark plugs removed...... drop the lower unit!

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

If you can't turn the flywheel by hand with the spark plugs removed...... drop the lower unit!

Thanks Joe. I just pulled the spark plugs and was not able to turn the flywheel more than 3 inches or so then it goes back to the starting position. I will drop the lower until this weekend.

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

When you have the spark plugs removed, shine a pencil light into each plug hole. Visually inspect for any damage before you pull the lower unit. If you've got something serious going on inside the powerhead, you may be able to see it.

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

When you have the spark plugs removed, shine a pencil light into each plug hole. Visually inspect for any damage before you pull the lower unit. If you've got something serious going on inside the powerhead, you may be able to see it.

Thank you for information. Here are a couple of pictures inside the spark plug holes of the powerhead.

I went to pull the lower unit off but, I ran into a problem. My service manual tells me to disconnect my shift rod connector from the bell-crank by loosening bell-crank screw (I did that but unsure how much) and nut (I did that). Now spread the bell-crank halves apart and disconnect the shift rod connector from the bell-crank.

My Questions:

• How much do I need to loosen bell-crank screw and if I loosen it too much how hard is it to put back?
• How much do I need to spread the bell-crank to release the shift rod connector and how will I know when it is released?

Thank you,

detoxed

 

[powerslide]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

i am far from a pro as you can see i have asked alot of questions and this will be my first attempt at an answer. I think you are trying to take the shift rod off in the wrong spot. if you look from the right side the side where the driver would sit and look under the carbs you will see the shift rod screw going into the shift rod. you will need a screw long screw driver to reach it and hooking it back up is a bear. Mine was really tight and i actually had to use a socket and extension to bust it loose.

this page has the best pic i can find http://www.bassboatcentral.com/johnrudetips.htm

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

Your engine, as you have found, has the two levers that go in front and in back of the shift barrel that sits on top of the shift rod.

It's best to simply remove that arrangement and get it out of your way. It's not that difficult to put back together. JUst make a note of what bolt, washer, etc goes where... it's no big deal.

Disconnect the shift cable. Remove the 3/8" nut from those levers. Remove the large shoulder bolt from the center of the levers. Separate the levers from the shift rod barrel. That disconnects the shift rod and gets everything out of your way.

Note that there is a very small white bushing in the hole of the shift rod barrel. That bushing must absolutely be there... if it is missing, there is no way that the unit will shift properly!

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

Well, I successfully removed the lower unit and the flywheel rotates by hand. The lower unit will not spin. Do I now disassemble the lower unit ? If yes what should I be looking for?

Thank you,

detox

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

This simply proves that the powerhead isn't seized and pinpoints where the problem is. Next step is to dismantle the lower unit, then sort the bad parts from the good to get an idea of what you're facing price wise for parts. You're not looking for anything specific, just something that's not as it should be. Normally it's better to simply pick up a good used lower unit at a fair price.... others here will advise you as to what to expect to pay for a good used unit.

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

Ok Here goes.

I removed the lower unit. I started on the first step (per Service Manual) and removed the Impeller Housing Screws. After about a few minutes I was finally able to pry the housing out. This is what I found tangled up inside the housing. I am able to move the Drive Shaft I tested in neutral, forward and reverse. All appear to be work as they should. What would my next step be replace the water pump or just the impeller?

Thank you,

detox

 

[boobie]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

Get the whole w/p kit and stick in it. Aint seen one that bad in some time. Also check your g/c oil for any water.

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

Ok,

How much water should be coming out of exhaust tubes?

I installed a new water pump kit. Now I fear that I may have not correctly lined up the water tubes on the pump housing with the tubes from the exhaust housing when sliding the lower unit into place. The metal tubes keep cutting into the plastic ones when I was lining them up. I thought I had finally got it to line up until I ran the motor in a water tank. There was only a little water spitting out the top two exhaust tubes.

I sure hope I do not have drop it again.

Thank you for all your help.

detox

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

That engine does not have the normal telltale water nozzle. Those came out in 1978. It sounds like your engine is pumping water properly. Start the engine on the garden hose. Hold your hand behind the two exhaust relief ports at the top of the midsection. After 30-60 seconds of running on a cold engine, the thermostat (vernatherm) will open. When it does, water droplets will start to form on the palm of your hand. That's normal. If you borrow a laser temp gun, you can easily measure the temps of each head. Anything up to about 150 is normal. Perhaps cooler if you are on the garden hose.

 

[detox]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

That engine does not have the normal telltale water nozzle. Those came out in 1978. It sounds like your engine is pumping water properly. Start the engine on the garden hose. Hold your hand behind the two exhaust relief ports at the top of the midsection. After 30-60 seconds of running on a cold engine, the thermostat (vernatherm) will open. When it does, water droplets will start to form on the palm of your hand. That's normal.

That is exactly what it is doing. For some reason I thought there was a steady flow of water that was suppose to be coming out.

If you borrow a laser temp gun, you can easily measure the temps of each head. Anything up to about 150 is normal. Perhaps cooler if you are on the garden hose.

Thank you. I will break out the laser.

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Johnson 1977 115hp 115ETL77 Stuck/Seized?

You'll get a steady flow of water on the 78 and later V4 models-when they went to dual thermostats and changed the powerhead base and exhaust adapter.