70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

kryck

Cadet
Joined
Jul 9, 2009
Messages
28
History: Bought a 70 hp Evinrude from 1987 with top piston/cylinder scorched.
Rebored all three cylinders
Changed pistons and rings
Changed the wristpin and rod bearings
Replaced all powerhead seals and gaskets
Rebuilt carburetors
New waterpump

The engine starts but runs rough on the top cylinder. It spits back fuel through the top carburetor causing alot of lean popping. Cylinder 2 and 3 apears to be running just fine.

To eliminate the possibillity of faulty reeds I changed place of the reed box from cylinder one and two. After switch cylinder two still runs fine and cyilnder one is spitting back through carb and leanpopping. I used a 8 mm hose as listening device (stetoscope?) and put it through the carbs and spun the flywheel by hand (plugs out). Cylinder three and two sounds alike and there's no blowing sound as the piston goes down. On cylinder one there's quite a strong blowing sound as the piston goes down. This blowing sound is not from reeds or a faulty gasket but from a canal that starts just outside the reeds (towards carbs) and leads up to the top main bearing.

I guess that the idea is that some of the fuel/oil mix is picked up before the reeds (by negative crankcase pressure) and routed through the main bearing and thereby lubricationg it before it mixes with the rest of the fuel/oil (that took the normal through-the-reeds way) in the crankcase.

Somehow the flow in this canal is to great (at least one way) and much of the fuel/oil is blown back through it causing lean conditions. This have lead me to think that theres a restrictor or one way valve missing. Either that or the flow through the top main bearing is to great wich I think is less probable. My seloc repair manuel mentions nothing of above at all and from different crank case and manifold "break up diagrams" I've found on the web I can't seem to get any clue either.

Info: Hole in main bearing is about 5 mm, connecting hole in crankcas cover is about 8 mm on the bearing side and about 3x5 mm on the manifold side. And the routing in the manifold (behind the gasket) is about 2 mm wide and deep. This is obviously to big to restrict blowback. I'll try to post som photos of this.
 

kryck

Cadet
Joined
Jul 9, 2009
Messages
28
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

1. routing on reed side of manifold plate.
2. Canal opening in crankcase cover towards manifold plate.
3. Canal opening in crankcase cover towards top main bearing.

No photo of top main bearing but it has a 5 mm hole that matches the 8 mm hole in the crankcase cover. I think the 8 mm hole in the crakcase cover looks like it should hold som kind of restrictor or one way valve but I've found no info to support this guesses.
 

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kryck

Cadet
Joined
Jul 9, 2009
Messages
28
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

OK. I've let go of the thoughts about top cylinder ventilating through that routing, guess this is normal and a part of the lubing system for the top main bearing.

Problem still stands! Top cylinder is not running OK at lower rpm's, in fact i think it's not running at all until about 2500 rpm. At idle and up 'til 2500 rpm the motor shakes badly and sounds awful (like running on two cylinders). Then at about 2500 rpm it starts runnig and sounding OK and from here theres no problems up 'til about 5000 rpm wich is max, and I think this should be 5500 - 6000.

I tore down the carbs again. This time I even removed the caps and leadshots (wich I din't do the last time). No debris or gummy materials found and all jets and orifices clear.

Link & Sync set to pickup at 4 atdc and full advance in 17 btdc. Carbs open at the same time and are fully closed at idle. Ignition strobe connected to cyl one shows no deviations in ignintion. Compression tested dry to 120-110-115 wich I think seems good and equal enough. It doesn't seem to leak from the crankcase either, no fuel/oil visible in crankcase joints or under flywheel. Have also replaced the reeds to composite ones.

Sounds to me like I got spark, compression and fuel but somehow it doesn't run OK anyway. But I still think this is fuel/air related in some way I can't understand.

Ideas anyone?
 

kenmyfam

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 10, 2006
Messages
14,385
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

Spark test O.K. ??? jumping a good gap ???
Done any swapping around of the ignition items to see if the issue moves to a different cylinder ??
 

ENSIGN

Lieutenant Junior Grade
Joined
Jun 21, 2009
Messages
1,179
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

How about switching carbs for a test?
 

HybridMX6

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 22, 2008
Messages
676
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

did you set each carb individually? Each one has to be set individually. I sold a 3cyl. 60hp from '92 and had top cylinder issues similar to this, just had to set the carbs. Not sure if you have done that yet or not, as each one will most likely be different than the other. Really need to be set on the water, running in idle, with a fully warmed up engine.
 

F_R

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
28,195
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

lryck, it is obvious that you are a whole lot smarter than the average bear, so I'm going to refrain from making overly simplistic suggestions that you would have caught by yourself. Trouble is, I don't have a good answer for you.

I think you might be on the right track with that oiling channel being excessive, but I just don't know. Did you by any chance change the top bearing? Is there any chance it isn't the original one? I guess you know where I am going with this----perhaps the oil hole in the bearing is supposed to be smaller. Unlikely, I know.

I think at this point I would be tempted to block that passage just temporarilly with a piece of shim stock with the gasket and see what happens. Needless to say, very temporary and at slow rpms.
 

Faztbullet

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 2, 2008
Messages
15,619
Re: 70 hp 1987. Carb blowback - not reeds

Pull the head and check the piston as if installed upside down cylinder will not make power and cause idling problems also. It could have been mismarked at factory, compare ring gap location on it to other cylinders.
 
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