Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

[greenejr]

I have a Johnson 150 that runs great except when I run it to a place and then tilt motor she cools for more than 15 min. I start the engine and she doesn't want to do much more than idle. If I try to give throttle she stalls (like flooding) spiting and dieing. I though if I primed the bulb that would fixed but it died immediately upon prime. If I start and let idle underway for a couple of mins then it will go. This never happens from idle again as long as I don't shut it down and let it cool some. I sometimes smell gas too.

 

[Seasport]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Welcome greenejr.<br />Do a search for my post "150 Johnson dies from warm start" Many people with these motors (late model 150/175's) report very similar problems, i.e. they start and run from cold just fine but run them and then sit a while and they are hard to get going again. Once going they run just fine.<br /><br />I'm not sure tilting the motor makes any difference. Are you sure this doesn't happen even if the motor is not tilted?<br /><br />With my motor, I give the primer bulb a good pump and then when the motor starts I give it a bit of a rev in neutral to get it going and then I can take off OK. Seems to work for me and others I've talked to. If I don't do this, it either stalls at idle or bogs down & stalls when I put it in gear.<br /><br />There are various theories as to what causes this problem. I'm not sure we have really nailed it down to one thing but there may be a combination of contributing factors. It's important that ignition timing is set correctly and that the ignition timing advance and carb operation are synchronised correctly (i.e. link & sync). Check out my post for a list of things to check.

 

[Little Cormorant]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Originally posted by greenejr:<br /> I have a Johnson 150 that runs great except when I run it to a place and then tilt motor she cools for more than 15 min. I start the engine and she doesn't want to do much more than idle. If I try to give throttle she stalls (like flooding) spiting and dieing. I though if I primed the bulb that would fixed but it died immediately upon prime. If I start and let idle underway for a couple of mins then it will go. This never happens from idle again as long as I don't shut it down and let it cool some. I sometimes smell gas too.

 

[Little Cormorant]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

I also have a 150 HP Johnson 2 stroke. You can run the motor for 15 minutes to an hour and no problem. Once let the boat sit for 15 minutes, will not restart. I have had my boat to an authorized Johnson dealer for 11 weeks in 2005. They have replaced all fuel lines, fuel tank, check timing, compression, put in a new carberator kit, replaced fuel pump. They are going to replace fuels line in the motor this week. Can someone help me, frustrated in Minnesota!

 

[clanton]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

It will help some to replace the diaphram in vaper pump located in the vapor seperator. clean and increase the size the primer nipple by .010/.015. The engine is very lean on start or restart. It is very inportant to use orginal sparkplug, sparkplug wires. Area around the coils, between the coils and pack must be clean and dry. All wires in correct location. Connections between engine harness and control clean and dry. Check the 6 pin connector with black/yellow wire for arcing.

 

[Seasport]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

We could definitely start a club for people with late model 150's who have similar problems. Little Cormorant your problem sounds a little more serious - I take it that your motor doesn't start at all once it has been sitting for a while when warm?<br /><br />Check that your timing sensor plate (on top of the flywheel) is rotating freely and returns to it's idle position as the throttle is closed. The timing sensor is attached to a rotating plate which rotates in a plastic track. A few people have reported sticky timing plates which means ignition timing could be too far advanced when starting. Don't think this would stop the motor starting, but may cause problems taking off.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

What spark plugs is everybody using?<br /><br />What octane fuel?<br /><br />I have a 93 60* 150 and have never had these problems. No matter how long you run it or how long it sits between runs. And we've had 2 different powerheads on it testing pistons. Two buddys have the same motor (different years) and neither of them have these problems either. Come to think of it I used to have a 1991 150 on a ski boat. No problems there either.<br /><br />The motor has Quick Start so you don't even have to give it throttle when starting.

 

[Seasport]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Dhadley, is yours an OIS ignition system (I think it should be)? The problem only seems to happen with later model 150's with OIS (for whatever reason). My motor is a 2001 model.<br /><br />Enough people have reported very similar problems (& I've been in touch with a few of them) to suggest it's a common problem (if not a weakness) with these motors.<br /><br />I'm running the recommended Champion plugs with 91 octane fuel. I did a timing check and lync & sync on my motor a few months back. Timing may have been a bit out. However, it's been winter here and I've only run the boat once since and didn't get a chance to check it out properly. May be fine now but will confirm next time I get the boat out (hopefully real soon).<br /><br />My motor starts just fine and idles OK but it bogs down when you try to accelerate. Exactly the same symptoms that greenejr reports above.<br /><br />Next on the list for me will be to richen the idle screws a bit. Others have reported that this helps.

 

[clanton]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

I see a lot of hardstarting when cold, Im sure this is lean mixture. Other problems with this engine in the sensor and power pack. The OMC tool that check the sensor is junk. One poster explained how to check sensor with a scope. The sine wave must have square corners, if the corners of the wave form is squiggle, the engine will misfire, stumble, stop running when hot. The coils burn thru the insulation and arc to the metal plate between the pack and the coils, all of this arcing not caused by poor coil insulation, I had some discussing about this pack with Rapair Monday while I was touring the Rapair plant.<br /><br />The vapor seperator has a diaphram pump to remove the vapors, if the pump not working, you may have vapor lock after hot soak.<br /><br />Newer ignition switches also cause problems, there was at least one recall and one service bulletin on the switches, and I still think they are junk. I also beleave that there still is a quality control problem with some replacement parts. Wrong part in right box, right part right box defective part. Im rambling now, but if DH or Rodbolt cant fix it, call me.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

All the 60* motors have OIS. However, we do see a couple of common things among those who seem to have problems with warm starting. One is fuel. Folks who run high test fuel seem to run into this. Seasport, I believe your 91 is the same as our 87, right? Thats what the motors were designed to run on.<br /><br />Another is spark plugs. For some reason we see hotter plugs than called for in these motors. We use the QL78YC or the cooler QL77JC4. No problem.<br /><br />Every once in a while I see someone trying to start one of these motors by adding throttle. They seem to have a problem but once they are shown how Quick Start works they're OK.

 

[steamboatwilly]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Good evening Everybody.If I may jump in .Ive been reading this.I just got back from the lake.My motor is a 89-150J.It starts perfect when cold,runs perfect.It turns a 24Raker 5500-5700 on a 18ft.Venture at 63-65mph gps.(not if wife in boat)When I shut it down first time(only) it will not start if it sets a while.It wont do it any more the rest of the day.I had AC gapless plugs in it ,it didnt do this with AC.I got scared and put stainless ql77jc4 Champs back in.My wife with me today .If not I wouldve give it some words.When I tilted to get above stumps,gas drained out.I might not be priming enouth,I dont know.I hope this dont add any convusion.

 

[Seasport]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

There may be a variety of problems we're talking about here. My experience, and that of quite a few others, is that the motor starts up just fine (at first turn of the key) and will usually idle OK. The problem occurs when you try to take off - the motor bogs down. You need to give the motor a bit of a rev in neutral to "clear" it. Then you can take off. This seems like a fuel problem but it doesn't happen when the motor is cold - only when it has been sitting after running. The vapor seperator sounds like a plausible cause. Is there a way to test this?<br /><br />I'm well acquainted with the OIS system. I designed and built a simple analyzer to allow checking the timing statically. Works fine and way cheaper than the OMC one. I can provide DIY details if anyone wants to build their own. From a design perspective, the OIS system should be better than the conventional inductive pickup system. It uses a slotted plastic wheel and infra-red diode and photodetector. The edges of the pulses should be a lot sharper than with the trigger coil system.<br /><br />A scope would be a better way of checking the dynamic operation of the sensor than using the OMC tool - which must just count the pulses per revolution. The pulses should be square providing the plastic wheel is undamaged but I guess faulty electronics might cause "ringing" which is what clanton is referring to.<br /><br />Dhadley not sure of the equivalence of our fuel. I thought octane was octane but with the different neasurement units that we use it gets confusing! I'm running the recommended Champion plugs. Can't remember the number and don't have the manual here.<br /><br />I really need to give my motor a good test. Last time I went out (following my timing adjustment & lync & sync) it seemed OK but I didn't get a chance to give it a proper test. Now that the weather is getting better, I should get a chance real son. Thanks for your advice.

 

[midtvedt]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Originally posted by greenejr:<br /> I have a Johnson 150 that runs great except when I run it to a place and then tilt motor she cools for more than 15 min. I start the engine and she doesn't want to do much more than idle. If I try to give throttle she stalls (like flooding) spiting and dieing. I though if I primed the bulb that would fixed but it died immediately upon prime. If I start and let idle underway for a couple of mins then it will go. This never happens from idle again as long as I don't shut it down and let it cool some. I sometimes smell gas too.

 

[midtvedt]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Hi - It appears we are not alone. I have a 1998 Johnson 115. I just purchased the boat, reportedly with low hours, and have the same idle-in-gear problem once it cools??? My mechanic changed the coils, soaked the carbs... Has anyone seen any service bulletins on this problem?

 

[MCM]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Hi, I don,t have a solution here just an observation. Older automobile engines used to have a similar problem as I recall, used to call it vapor locking, been so long ago I can't remember what the cause/fix was.<br /><br />Mike

 

[MCM]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Hi, it seems after reading this article and talking to my Dad (an older mechanic) that vapor locking was actually a symtom of overheating and letting the engine cool was the cure<br /><br /> http://www.maxrules.com/fixgas.html <br /><br />Sorry for any confusion I may have caused,<br />Mike

 

[Seasport]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

You'd think if it was vapor lock that the motor wouldn't start at all. Over-lean idle mixture is a possible cause. The problem is aggravated when the motor is warm and Quickstart isn't active.

 

[Oreo]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Reading this I had to dig it back up again as I too have been trying to work out this issue with my 03 150hp Johnson. Have had it in the shop several times and they set timing, replaced fuel pump diaphrams, cleaned carbs, drained and cleaned fuel tank, replaced all filters and fuel line bulb.

It truly is hit and miss as sometimes I can fish for days without seeing the issue and then there it is again. It is impossible to reproduce on muffs or in a tank so I understand why the Mech thinks I'm just picky but it bugs the crap out of me when it happens.

The last time it did this was a couple weeks ago and I placed the motor into Neutral, pressed the release button and slowly moved the throttle forward and when I got to 1500 - 2000rpm the motor would start stumbling and if I left it there it would shut down. On restart I tried this again and once again it began to stumble I worked the throttle back and forth quickly from ilde position to WOT and once I got the engine past that 1500 - 2000 rpm level she would spin up fine. Backed it off, engaged forward gear and shot the juice to her and she bowed and then hopped on plane.

I have also checked to see if any of the hoses, tubes are limiting the linkage but everthing is clear. At first I was thinking a fuel issue however as stated above pumping the bulb wouldn't resolve the issue. As a matter a fact pumping the bulb resulted in the engine shutting down.

With that said we're leaning toward timing advance issue but haven't been able to find anything with this. Has anybody gotten any more info on this? What have I missed? Suggestions?

The dealer said they could take the boat out and run it at the lake for about $100 an hour. I told the counter guy for that kinda of money I'd rather take the mechanic fishing. From around the corner the Mechanic popped in and said have tools will travel. If this continues It looks like I may be taking the Mechanic on a little fishing trip. Hell if it gets it fixed it would be worth it.

 

[goshgo27]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Hi all, I have the as,e engine 03 150hp Johnson and the same issue. Runs perfect until I shut down for an hour or so then does the bogging/stalling thing. I found that if I turn it on and let it run every 20-30 minutes, I can sometimes prevent this. I've always thought this was vapor lock and the solution was to just wrap the fuel lines with aluminum foil. It's been a few Years and I'm about to finally try this. I apologize for replying to an older thread. If anyone came up with other solutions, please share. Thanks

Reading this I had to dig it back up again as I too have been trying to work out this issue with my 03 150hp Johnson. Have had it in the shop several times and they set timing, replaced fuel pump diaphrams, cleaned carbs, drained and cleaned fuel tank, replaced all filters and fuel line bulb.

It truly is hit and miss as sometimes I can fish for days without seeing the issue and then there it is again. It is impossible to reproduce on muffs or in a tank so I understand why the Mech thinks I'm just picky but it bugs the crap out of me when it happens.

The last time it did this was a couple weeks ago and I placed the motor into Neutral, pressed the release button and slowly moved the throttle forward and when I got to 1500 - 2000rpm the motor would start stumbling and if I left it there it would shut down. On restart I tried this again and once again it began to stumble I worked the throttle back and forth quickly from ilde position to WOT and once I got the engine past that 1500 - 2000 rpm level she would spin up fine. Backed it off, engaged forward gear and shot the juice to her and she bowed and then hopped on plane.

I have also checked to see if any of the hoses, tubes are limiting the linkage but everthing is clear. At first I was thinking a fuel issue however as stated above pumping the bulb wouldn't resolve the issue. As a matter a fact pumping the bulb resulted in the engine shutting down.

With that said we're leaning toward timing advance issue but haven't been able to find anything with this. Has anybody gotten any more info on this? What have I missed? Suggestions?

The dealer said they could take the boat out and run it at the lake for about $100 an hour. I told the counter guy for that kinda of money I'd rather take the mechanic fishing. From around the corner the Mechanic popped in and said have tools will travel. If this continues It looks like I may be taking the Mechanic on a little fishing trip. Hell if it gets it fixed it would be worth it.

 

[alley mechanic]

Re: Hot start problem on 2003 Johnson 150

Hello all, i was reading all the hot start issues with the jhonson 150, well i have a 98 evenrude 115 intruder that started doing the same thing a few years ago , so i rebuilt and cleaned the carbs link and sink checked coils and even replaced power pak optical sensor and a new stator well it didnt fix the problem, well i said what have i been missing ethenol in gas yep i guess i was getting non ethenol for a longer time and than the station where i bought my gas from started selling it, you see here in indiana the stations dont have to label pumps . Well i bought a test kit and i had ethenol 10% in tank so i went to a marina and bought non ethenol and started deluting it down well the motor started to run better and better ethenol sucks carbed evenrude johnson outboards dont like it my motor runs like a scared rabbit now that i dont have any ethenol in the gas , would like to know what gas you other fellas are running could be your culpret too.

Alley mechanic