1967 Johnson 3hp - sitting in woods for 17 years

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
Hi All,

Quick backstory, my dad passed away 17 years ago a few months after Duck season. Couple weekends ago, my brother and I were up at our 120 acres of forest surrounding two small duck ponds. After parking our aluminum boat on the shoreline, walking back up to our cabin through the woods i kicked a hard object. Well low and behold, it was my dad's old 1967 johnson 3hp, half enveloped in the ground! Apparently he had not stored it inside after he had hunted last and it was forgotten about.

I brought it home and started taking things apart. I've been going through some basic steps found in the Top Secret file on the forum to get it running again and i am stumped as to what to try next.

Troubleshooting steps taken so far:
1. Fuelline was closed, emptied tank and flushed with fresh gas, looks good inside. Fresh mixed gas put in.
2. Rebuilt carb, surprisingly, it was spotless inside. Low speed needle was closed then opened 1 1/2 turns. So it sits on "lean" when put back together.
3. Noticed i had no spark, Tested coil and plug cables, both were good.
4. Replaced condensers, and points, gapped to .20.
5. New plugs, gapped to .30, tested plugs, solid blue spark.
6. Put WD-40 in cylinders to give them a little extra lube.
7. Ran compression test, both cylinders were around 75psi.

When i go to start it, it does not seem to fire at all. The plugs look wet when i pull them, I've adjusted the lean/rich knob a bit and still not noticing it fire at all. Squirting a little wd-40 does not seem to fire either. I've opened up the top and verified the points are still at .20. I have the throttle set to "start" when pulling.

I am determined to get this working, anyone have some other ideas i can try?!

Model No: JW22 C
Serial No: E2752793

Gilby
 

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
Just opened a plug to 5/16th, I get a spark on both cables. It's white, not blue. But it's nice and bright.
 

oldboat1

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Apr 3, 2002
Messages
9,598
Test may work, but really should set the plugs aside, and test the leads for spark using an adjustable spark tester -- that's the 5/16 inch spark racerone mentions. It would be remarkable if coils survived (may give you a little life, but likely will not last).

The idle screw is positioned, then the knob is pulled off and repositioned so you can adjust a half turn richer or a half turn leaner (stop prevents turning the knob 360 degrees). In practice, you would adjust much less than that -- maybe 1/8 or 1/4 turn. On one of my motors, I routinely set it 1/4 turn richer for cold starting, then adjust back for normal running position. On most motors, you set and forget the needle(s).

Drain the gearcase and refill it. Check the lower unit housing for cracks from freezing, if the property is up where things freeze.

Great story to go with the motor!
 

F_R

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
28,195
On a motor that old, chances are 99-1/2 out of a possible 100 that the coils are bad. Unless you have that other 1/2, yours are bad also. And the symptoms back that up.

Giving you the benefit of doubt, are you absolutely positive the high speed jet (orifice plug) is clean without a trace of any gum, dirt, or varnish? Fuel filter not clogged?

Being buried for 17 years brings up lots of other possibilities also. How many ants and other critters have made their home in the reeds, for example.
 

Joe Reeves

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
13,262
I assume that fuel had entered the carburetor float chamber?

Did you manually clean the high speed jet located in the bottom center portion of the float chamber, way in back of the drain screw? If not, do so as fuel must flow freely through that jet before it gains access to any other fuel passageway.

(Carburetor Adjustment - Single S/S Adjustable Needle Valve)
(J. Reeves)

Initial setting is: Slow speed = seat gently, then open 1-1/2 turns.

Start engine and set the rpms to where it just stays running. In segments of 1/8 turns, start to turn the S/S needle valve in. Wait a few seconds for the engine to respond. As you turn the valve in, the rpms will increase. Lower the rpms again to where the engine will just stay running.

Eventually you'll hit the point where the engine wants to die out or it will spit back (sounds like a mild backfire). At that point, back out the valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest slow speed setting.

When you have finished the above adjustment, you will have no reason to move them again unless the carburetor fouls/gums up from sitting, in which case you would be required to remove, clean, and rebuild the carburetor anyway.
 

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
Thanks for all the helpful tips! This gives me a few things to try this week. I will be sure to follow up with results!
 

ozarkrivers

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Apr 3, 2017
Messages
41
I can't offer much advice. But your post title had me!! Ill be keeping up with this for sure! Glad you found that old thing!
 

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
Update: I went back and reseated points and re-gapped. I also took the carb apart again and confirmed everything was clean and in the right spots.

I can now get it to fire, but it is pulling hard. I notice on my pulls the throttle lever moves a good inch or so each pull to the left. Almost as if something is catching? Any experiences with this?

Occasionally it will pull smooth and not catch which will fire the motor, other pulls are tougher and lever is moving.

Thanks for any tips!

Ps impeller is on order, trying to get it running in the interim.

Gilby
 

Joe Reeves

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
13,262
You make mention of: " I notice on my pulls the throttle lever moves a good inch or so each pull to the left. Almost as if something is catching?"

Check (as follows) that you (or someone) has not installed the coils etc under the flywheel improperly.

(Magneto & Driver Coil Alignment)
(J. Reeves)

To align the coils properly, have the metal vertical portion of the coil yokes aligned with the inside edge of the bevel that exists on the top portion of the aluminum seat upon which the coils sit. This creates the proper distance between the coils and the flywheel magnets. Faulty alignment creates friction and the yokes of the coils heat up, turn blue and expand.
 

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
That was exactly the issue, one of the coils was seated too far out and was catching.

So now... Pulls nice and smooth, but when I get it going it putters out after 10 seconds or so. I have the low speed idle set to 1 1/2 turns out.

When it starts I try to give it throttle which only seems to increase speeds a tad, then it dies out.

I'm also starting it on the start location, motor seems to act like it's set to slow.
 

oldboat1

Fleet Admiral
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Apr 3, 2002
Messages
9,598
Adjust the idle needle a bit leaner (clockwise) and see if rpms increase. Keep adjusting until the engine wants to backfire (lean sneeze) or stalls, then back the needle out about 1/4 turn. That should be close to the sweet spot. (When rpms increase, throttle the engine down a bit and keep adjusting the idle needle.)

I'm not sure if you have a cam roller on that motor, or just the arm, but the roller or cam should touch the scribed mark on the horizontal throttle cam (on the throttle/timing plate) just as the carb throttle plate begins to open.
 

F_R

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
28,195
There is a sintered bronze (made up of a bazillion tiny balls fused together) filter in the gas tank. They are very effective--almost too effective when they won't pass enough fuel to keep the motor running. You are supposed to replace it when clogged. Some guys claim they were able to clean them. Personally, I replace them with bronze filter screen.
 

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
Been messing with the carb needle for thr last hour. Had it running for about 60 seconds with choke engaged. But now i can't get it to keep going for the life of me. Because it was running, would that rule out the coils? Both plugs have spark when I test, but those are the one thing I have not replaced.

Plugs have gas on them when I check also, tried leaner and richer settings on needle, but only fires for a few seconds after 10-15 pulls.

In regards to the tank filter, if I pull the hose I get a solid trickle of fuel. It does not appear to be clogged.
 

Joe Reeves

Supreme Mariner
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Feb 24, 2002
Messages
13,262
In all probability, as other members have expressed, the fuel filter in the tank is gummed up. To test, simply remove the line from the carburetor and observe the flow.

Double check the carburetor to see if the fuel is entering the float chamber.

(Carburetor Adjustment - Single S/S Adjustable Needle Valve)
(J. Reeves)

Initial setting is: Slow speed = seat gently, then open 1-1/2 turns.

Start engine and set the rpms to where it just stays running. In segments of 1/8 turns, start to turn the S/S needle valve in. Wait a few seconds for the engine to respond. As you turn the valve in, the rpms will increase. Lower the rpms again to where the engine will just stay running.

Eventually you'll hit the point where the engine wants to die out or it will spit back (sounds like a mild backfire). At that point, back out the valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest slow speed setting.

When you have finished the above adjustment, you will have no reason to move them again unless the carburetor fouls/gums up from sitting, in which case you would be required to remove, clean, and rebuild the carburetor anyway.
 

oldboat1

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Apr 3, 2002
Messages
9,598
Assuming you can observe fuel flow from the tank, I would suspect the carb. To clean, it has to be completely disassembled and soaked in a solvent strong enough to cut through varnished fuel. I use lacquer thinner. The vertical nozzle up in the center has to come out for soaking and cleaning (need a piece of thin wire to clear all of the little openings, followed with a spray of carb cleaner. Given your issues, I would also be sure to take off the domed fitting at the top and remove the needle (soak the whole top half), then make sure the small openings in the idle passage are clear, and the needle point properly seats in the orifice. Make sure the opening isn't blocked with the broken tip of another needle.

Soak the bowl -- I would do so with the h.s. jet in place (remove the hex bolt or stud at the bottom before soaking). Carefully run a thin piece of wire through the orifice to make sure its clear, then spray with carb cleaner using the plastic wand. At the bottom of the nozzle, you need the gasket (thick cork, usually) or the carb won't feed properly.

Doesn't take much of a blockage to cause problems....
 

Gilby

Cadet
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
10
Took the carb completely apart again, even took out the soft metal disc and lead sinkers. This thing is spotless. Watched a few rebuild videos on YouTube to ensure everything was in place. These carbs are quite simple, I'm confident it's good to go.

Still the same issues of it only firing for a few seconds. Since the coils and plug wires are the only thing I haven't replaced, I went ahead and ordered replacements. I'm hoping that is the cause.
 
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