Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower Unit

[ADAMAZ]

Last week I ordered a 2013 Tohatsu 4 stroke 9.8 outboardonline. Today I filled the motor with Sierra 25-40 outboard oil, put the prop/water inlets in a tub of water, connected the fuel line, opened the vent on the tank, primed it, put it in neutral, pulled out the choke and gave it the maiden pull. all I wanted to do was let it idle for 20 minutes or so before I took it out on a lake this weekend to troll around a bit and continue the break-in period.

Anyway, motor immediately started and water was coming out freely from the port. It started to smoke a bit, light grey, but I didn't think much of it. It was idling rough, then it settled down then you could tell it was not a healthy idle. At that time I noticed some oil in the water. It died just as I was going to kill it. I took photos of the leak. It's leaking to the left of the lower unit oil fill plug. I should note the upper oil plug on the lower unit was torqued so tight I could not remove it to check the level. All documentation says it is pre-filled at the factory and since the plug was torqued so tight (I tried to remove it for several minutes 2 or 3 different times) I assumed it was filled and re-tightened at the factory.

I put the prop back in water and tried to turn the motor over again. It will not start right now.

I am new to outboards and it's possible that is is an operator error somehow, but I do not see how. Any insight or advice? Worst part is the closest warranty dealer is in Phoenix and I live in Tucson.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

There is a definite possibility you are going about it wrong. You want 10w-30 NMMA FC-W oil. Only fill 1/2 to 3/4 on the dipstick (about 3/4 quart). Check the dipstick.

That sludge is coming from a drain, and may well be the result of an over-filled crankcase.

The drain plugs do need to be tight. You need a BIG screwdriver, and initially, you may need a "helper" wrench to crack the screw open.

 

[ADAMAZ]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Thanks for the feedback. I just checked the oil dipstick cold and it is at about 3/4 full. I used NMMA FC-W oil in 25w-40, which is ok per the manual. I didn't use 10w-30 as temps in AZ are typically above 100 degrees all summer. I only put in 23 ounces or so in the crankcase, so I really do not think it is a case of it being overfilled. The sludge drain has stopped leaking, although it did leak for a few hours overnight.

There is a definite possibility you are going about it wrong. You want 10w-30 NMMA FC-W oil. Only fill 1/2 to 3/4 on the dipstick (about 3/4 quart). Check the dipstick.

That sludge is coming from a drain, and may well be the result of an over-filled crankcase.

The drain plugs do need to be tight. You need a BIG screwdriver, and initially, you may need a "helper" wrench to crack the screw open.

 

[ADAMAZ]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Spoke with Tohatsu customer service this AM. They were very friendly and informative. He believes the issue is related to a clog in the fuel system. It's not terribly ucommon for the carb to get backed up and since the motor was shipped to me without an inspection (PDI) from the online dealer no system check was done. He said I could try to turn it over again, but more than likely the fuel system had some debris and that I should take it to a dealer and have them give it the once over. Of course it is under warranty.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Change your oil immediately to 10w-30. Fill to the bottom hash mark on the dip stick. Pull the spark plugs out of the engine and wipe them clean. With the plugs removed, pull the starter rope through 20 times to get rid of all the excess oil that wound up in the crankcase from when you raised the lower unit higher than the power head when you were moving the engine around. Put the plugs back in and restart. Once the engine begins running allow it to run at least 5 minutes to burn out the oil from the combustion chamber. Ignore the owner's manual about what oil you can use and just stick with the 10w-30.

You almost certainly do not have anything wrong with the engine and taking it into a dealer for them to tell you so is a waste of every-one's time....Of course it is possible that X could be wrong, it's just not very likely. What I think happened is actually very common with people who have never owned a small four-stroke engine. Gravity keeps the oil where it needs to be and more importantly keeps it out from where the Tohatsu Gods never designed it to be. When people pick up their engines to move them they tend to pull the cover to their belly and then swing the lower end up in the air...Often swinging it higher than the power head and that you cannot do. As soon as that lower unit swings up oil flows in all the wrong places causing dogs and cats to marry, ripping the fabric of time and causing my ex wife to spend more money on the dog than most people make in a year...

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

General statement for all who see this in the future:

Warranty is when something is wrong with the engine due to a defect in material or workmanship. It does not cover mistakes made by consumers. So, you take an engine in and a widget is bad...That's warranty. You take an engine in and there is water in the gas...That's a hundred dollar bill out of your pocket. Tohatsu tends to be very consumer friendly about covering iffy situations, but in the end if you caused the problem don't be surprised if you are told that it's not warranty.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

If the motor seems to be liquid locked, Elvin is 100% spot on (as usual).

Change your oil immediately to 10w-30. Fill to the bottom hash mark on the dip stick. Pull the spark plugs out of the engine and wipe them clean. With the plugs removed, pull the starter rope through 20 times to get rid of all the excess oil that wound up in the crankcase from when you raised the lower unit higher than the power head when you were moving the engine around. Put the plugs back in and restart. Once the engine begins running allow it to run at least 5 minutes to burn out the oil from the combustion chamber. Ignore the owner's manual about what oil you can use and just stick with the 10w-30.

You almost certainly do not have anything wrong with the engine and taking it into a dealer for them to tell you so is a waste of every-one's time....Of course it is possible that X could be wrong, it's just not very likely. What I think happened is actually very common with people who have never owned a small four-stroke engine. Gravity keeps the oil where it needs to be and more importantly keeps it out from where the Tohatsu Gods never designed it to be. When people pick up their engines to move them they tend to pull the cover to their belly and then swing the lower end up in the air...Often swinging it higher than the power head and that you cannot do. As soon as that lower unit swings up oil flows in all the wrong places causing dogs and cats to marry, ripping the fabric of time and causing my ex wife to spend more money on the dog than most people make in a year...

 

[ADAMAZ]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Gravity keeps the oil where it needs to be and more importantly keeps it out from where the Tohatsu Gods never designed it to be. When people pick up their engines to move them they tend to pull the cover to their belly and then swing the lower end up in the air...Often swinging it higher than the power head and that you cannot do.

Thank you for the reply. I am interpreting this to mean gear oil from the lower unit got into the powerhead assembly? If so, yes that is possible and it makes sense. Is there a reason 25w-40 is not good for my new motor?

 

[pvanv]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Thank you for the reply. I am interpreting this to mean gear oil from the lower unit got into the powerhead assembly? If so, yes that is possible and it makes sense. Is there a reason 25w-40 is not good for my new motor?

No, the LU is sealed. You cannot tilt the motor up, or the crankcase oil runs where it shouldn't. Just as you can't use a regular passenger car on its side or upside down.

Thicker oil will promote making oil. Ditto too much oil. 25w-40 is never good for any small 4-stroke outboard.

 

[TGuy]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

No, he means the crankcase oil will go where it shouldn't. That's why if you have to lay the motor down, you do it on a specific side (on the 9.8, the tiller handle is down on the ground). See owner's manual for details. Doing it that way keeps the powerhead slightly elevated which keeps the crankcase oil from spilling out. The lower unit gear lube/oil is not the problem.

 

[Sea Rider]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Paul what does the 4 strokes term "making oil" means ? If the oil dip stick mark should be set at full (second line) , why do you recommend to be 1/2 to 3/4 level ?

Happy Boating

 

[ADAMAZ]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

No, the LU is sealed. You cannot tilt the motor up, or the crankcase oil runs where it shouldn't. Just as you can't use a regular passenger car on its side or upside down.

Ok cool, but the motor was never laid on its side, etc. when the crankcase had oil in it. It's shipped empty and was filled when it was stored upright on a stand (see pic). It's never been laid on its side since being filled. If there was a little bit of oil in the crankcase from the factory maybe that caused it, but ti was always laid on the proper side (tiller handle down) and only stored that way when the crankcase was empty.

I appreciate the feedback and I am taking it to the dealer tomorrow. If it's a waste of time it's still piece of mind for me at this point. I should note I read the manual front to back and followed every step along the way. If my local authorized dealer says 25w-40 is a bad idea I'll pay him to drain it and fill it with 10w-30. Thanks again and I'll post dealer's feedback/assessment of issue in a few days.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

You filled the engine with oil while it was upright on the stand. Between there and when it was on the transom the lower unit was raised higher than the power head allowing the oil in the top of the engine to flow where it is not designed to flow. Imagine a level that you use to determine if something is level. Imagine that level turned 90 degrees with the bubble at the top. As you bring the top end down the bubble begins to move towards the other end. Imagine the bubble in the liquid being in the center. That's too far already. That bubble must remain higher than than in the middle at all times. Your engine position is like that bubble. When you carry the engine or when you take it on or off your boat it can never go to 90 degrees.

 

[ADAMAZ]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

You filled the engine with oil while it was upright on the stand. Between there and when it was on the transom the lower unit was raised higher than the power head allowing the oil in the top of the engine to flow where it is not designed to flow. Imagine a level that you use to determine if something is level. Imagine that level turned 90 degrees with the bubble at the top. As you bring the top end down the bubble begins to move towards the other end. Imagine the bubble in the liquid being in the center. That's too far already. That bubble must remain higher than than in the middle at all times. Your engine position is like that bubble. When you carry the engine or when you take it on or off your boat it can never go to 90 degrees.

I dig the concept. The motor was never on the transom. I had a water filled tub that fit under the stand.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Then my theory is shot all to hell So, could be anything. Fuel system is the most probable, but it could be anthing from a bad ground to a bad ECM. What part of the states are you located in?

 

[ADAMAZ]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Then my theory is shot all to hell So, could be anything. Fuel system is the most probable, but it could be anthing from a bad ground to a bad ECM. What part of the states are you located in?

Beautiful Tucson, AZ. Boater's Paradise in the Sonoran Desert. Not really My closet dealer is in Phoenix, which is also on the way to the good waters of Northern AZ and some of the deep canyon lakes formed around the Valley. I'm taking it to Glendale Marine tomorrow. I am 4 hours to the salt on the Sea of Cortez in Mexico, but I don't it would be wise or prudent to run my 77 14' Mirrocraft Deep V and new 9.8 Tohatsu in the ocean, at least not until I get the motor dialed in

Thanks again for your help man. I'll post up the diagnosis soon.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

Paul what does the 4 strokes term "making oil" means ? If the oil dip stick mark should be set at full (second line) , why do you recommend to be 1/2 to 3/4 level ? Happy Boating

Luis,

All 4 stroke OB's of all brands and all sizes tend to gain oil as a result of combustion by-products. There is an FAQ on that topic here on iBoats. Because the crankcase oil runs very cool (due to lake/sea water splashing), the situation is more pronounced than on a land-based motor. Because of that, especially when breaking in a new motor, starting off with the oil level a wee bit low gives you more "room" for the oil gain. This is all standard stuff with 4-strokes.

 

[SteveMFG_Oxford]

Re: Brand New Tohatsu 9.8 4 Stroke Dies After 2 minutes at Idle and Leaks from Lower

I bought a brand new 8 HP Nissan a while back. It worked well for about 5 hours then started acting up (overheating & poor stream). Ended up having a blown head gasket. The head had to be milled and new bolts. Seems fine now.

Just FYI if you should have further problem. If you have a torque wrench I would suggest re-torquing the head bolts to be safe. My bolts were stupid loose causing the blown head gasket. The pattern is marked on the head with raised numbers. At least mine was.

No, I didn't bother with a dealer. Too far away.

Good luck with it.