1989 Force 125 runs for a second

[NEKFORCE]

so i just rebuilt this force 125, it will not start in nutral, if i bypass the safty switch and put it in gear full throttle it runs for a second then dies like its out of fuel, I checked the timing with a timing light but am not sure exactly what i want with the three marks. When in nutral it cranks and cranks like it out of gas... any ideas?

if anyone has a picture of diagram of the impulse line please let me know.... I think thats my problem, i dident relize these have an impulse line off of the fuel pump? like a chainsaw. I think this is what i am missing.

 

[Jiggz]

I have the same motor but not sure what you meant by impulse line. Anyways, check make sure both idle mixture screws (brass screws on top of each carb) are set at least 1 1/2 turn from lightly seated. You will need to reset this as soon as you get it started. Next, make sure you do the following start up procedures:

1. Squeeze primer bulb until firm ( a clear fuel filter between the fuel pump and carb inlet is very beneficial for fuel related troubleshooting. Wally world has the Fram G2 for less than $5 and even comes with hose clamps.

2. Place throttle in fast idle

3. Make sure cooling water is connected. Engage the choke by pushing in the ignition key and keep pushing while rotating to start

4. If the motors starts, let it warm up. If motor only "coughs" then try again by turning off the ignition switch and starting again without the choke. It's very easy to flood the carbs with the choke, so be prudent on using it.

 

[NEKFORCE]

I have the same motor but not sure what you meant by impulse line. Anyways, check make sure both idle mixture screws (brass screws on top of each carb) are set at least 1 1/2 turn from lightly seated. You will need to reset this as soon as you get it started. Next, make sure you do the following start up procedures:

1. Squeeze primer bulb until firm ( a clear fuel filter between the fuel pump and carb inlet is very beneficial for fuel related troubleshooting. Wally world has the Fram G2 for less than $5 and even comes with hose clamps.

2. Place throttle in fast idle

3. Make sure cooling water is connected. Engage the choke by pushing in the ignition key and keep pushing while rotating to start

4. If the motors starts, let it warm up. If motor only "coughs" then try again by turning off the ignition switch and starting again without the choke. It's very easy to flood the carbs with the choke, so be prudent on using it.

Please explain what position "fast idle is on the throttle lever" I have never driven a boat before.
Also, I beleive there is an Impulse line, it gose from just under the fuel pump to the bottom brass conector on the bottom carberator. If this is true please let me know. This very muuch how a chainsaw draws fuel to its carberators as well.

 

[NEKFORCE]

Please explain what position "fast idle is on the throttle lever" I have never driven a boat before.
Also, I beleive there is an Impulse line, it gose from just under the fuel pump to the bottom brass conector on the bottom carberator. If this is true please let me know. This very muuch how a chainsaw draws fuel to its carberators as well.

well i hooked up that line but it made no difrence , still runs only full throttle for a second then dies like it can get fule.

 

[Jiggz]

Maybe if you can post a pic we can clarify. Anyways, fast idle position on the throttle is done in two ways, with two different style of throttles.

First, there is the center button that is pushed and then pushing the throttle handle forward. This will increase the idle rpm without engaging the driveshaft.
Second, is the involving pulling the handle from its axis of rotation towards the driver or port side and then pushing the handle forward.

The fuel pump has two hose connections. One for the suction and one for the outlet. There is no recirculation hose connections on the fuel pump that I am aware of. The outlet hose connects to the bottom carb's inlet (a "T" connection) and continues on to the top carb.


As mentioned, a clear fuel filter between the fuel pump outlet and the carb's inlet will help greatly with your troubleshooting. I highly recommend doing this.

 

[NEKFORCE]

1989 FORCE 125 Fuel pump question

When pumping the primer bulb, and you remove the exit fuel line from the fuel pump, should gas come out of that line?
I am starting to think my fuel pump is not working.
If i keep pumping the primer bulb, shouldent i be able to force gas all the way to the carbs?

 

[NEKFORCE]

Maybe if you can post a pic we can clarify. Anyways, fast idle position on the throttle is done in two ways, with two different style of throttles.

First, there is the center button that is pushed and then pushing the throttle handle forward. This will increase the idle rpm without engaging the driveshaft.
Second, is the involving pulling the handle from its axis of rotation towards the driver or port side and then pushing the handle forward.

The fuel pump has two hose connections. One for the suction and one for the outlet. There is no recirculation hose connections on the fuel pump that I am aware of. The outlet hose connects to the bottom carb's inlet (a "T" connection) and continues on to the top carb.


As mentioned, a clear fuel filter between the fuel pump outlet and the carb's inlet will help greatly with your troubleshooting. I highly recommend doing this.

yes this is the hose in question, the T is below the bottom carb.

 

[NEKFORCE]

yes this is the hose in question, the T is below the bottom carb.

I beleive my fuel pump is not working, since when i pump the bulb no gas comes out of this hose.

 

[NEKFORCE]

force 125 fule pump question

If i disconnect the fuel feed line from the pump to the carbs and pump the primer bulb. should fuel come out of the feed line?

 

[GA_Boater]

NEKFORCE - Please don't start more than one thread on the same problem. This confuses the responders and you.

The new threads have been merged into this thread.

 

[NEKFORCE]

NEKFORCE - Please don't start more than one thread on the same problem. This confuses the responders and you.

The new threads have been merged into this thread.

Sorry about that, I thought my other post was not saving and I tried a couple times.

 

[Jiggz]

Yup, assuming the inlet fuel hose to the fuel pump from the primer bulb and the fuel tank is connected, fuel should come out of the outlet hose (one that connects to the bottom of the carb). If no fuel is coming out disconnect the inlet fuel hose and squeeze the primer bulb and fuel should come out.

If fuel does comes out of the inlet hose, then the fuel pump has issues. If no fuel comes out of the inlet fuel hose then the primer bulb might have issues or the fuel tank is empty.

 

[NEKFORCE]

Yup, assuming the inlet fuel hose to the fuel pump from the primer bulb and the fuel tank is connected, fuel should come out of the outlet hose (one that connects to the bottom of the carb). If no fuel is coming out disconnect the inlet fuel hose and squeeze the primer bulb and fuel should come out.

If fuel does comes out of the inlet hose, then the fuel pump has issues. If no fuel comes out of the inlet fuel hose then the primer bulb might have issues or the fuel tank is empty.

Ah yes, I pumped and pumped and no fuel exited the fuel pump, I then disconnected the primer inlet line and some fuel came out, I have also pumped fuel directly from the tank like this so i know the primer is good.

When i get home i will pump the bulb and look for fuel from the feed line since i took the carbs off to clean them last night. I am sure my pump has issues. looks like i will need to find a rebuild kit someplace.

If i take that pump apart, is it usually obvious when the diaphragm is no good? like visibly torn?

 

[Jiggz]

On your other post, I have a pic of the fuel pump. And yes, it's really easy to work on it except if this is your first time, take your time to take pics or write down parts you pull out a step at a time especially its orientation. And they probably have the diaphragm here at iboat. Most of the time it is a torn diaphragm.

 

[NEKFORCE]

So i did take the pump apart, but found it has two outlets / feed lines. One goes into the block and the second goes to the lower tee on the carbs. with the second one disconnected no gas comes out. but when pumping and all is connected a lot gas runs out of the lower carb. (p2)
see included pic

 

[Jiggz]

No Title

This is what my fuel pump on '89-125HP looks like: If yours do not look like this maybe someone else can chime in.

 

[NEKFORCE]

This is what my fuel pump on '89-125HP looks like: If yours do not look like this maybe someone else can chime in.

Yes that is exactly what mine looks like. However no fuel comes out of my outlet line, It is coming out of the inlet line from the tank no problem. gas is only getting into the bottom cylinder(s) but not through the fuel line, quite possibly its going through the bottom recirculation line if thats at all possible? Finally when i took the pump apart there were no obvious signs of damage to the diaphram, I will now need to get a rebuild kit for the pump though as the gaskets did not come apart all that nicely. I beleive my pump had a problem, i just dont know what as I have never seen one of these work before. As mentioned earlier in the thread, the clear filter is a good idea for visual inspection, i will add one in my system. Has anyone here seen a failure of the pump like what i am describing? how file gets into the lower cyls but not the upper, and no gas comes out outlet?

Also, has anyone seen a bad pump ruin a motor before? causing a lean condition?

 

[NEKFORCE]

So i did take the pump apart, but found it has two outlets / feed lines. One goes into the block and the second goes to the lower tee on the carbs. with the second one disconnected no gas comes out. but when pumping and all is connected a lot gas runs out of the lower carb. (p2)
see included pic

I now see that the line i call p2 is a recirculation line, and I beleive should not have gas going through it from the pump to the inside of the motor.

 

[Jiggz]

If you can post a pic of your fuel pump and ID the hoses, it'll greatly help. Fuel may come out of the recirc lines if disconnected. But this is just residual fuel.

What you refer as p2 is actually a recirc line that goes to the cylinder cover. No fuel should be coming out of this connection. The only two connections located above the diaphragm are the only ones where fuel should be present. One connector to the sediment bowl (fuel inlet from primer bulb) and one connector to the pump body (outlet) that connects to the bottom carb.