Force 120 Engine Mounts

Frosty1308

Cadet
Joined
Mar 20, 2017
Messages
11
Hi all, first off an introduction, I've just joined the forums after buying my first boat last week. I'll start off by saying a big thanks to the community for all the knowledge I've already gained from reading so far, it's been invaluable! My dad has owned boats all my life so I'm no stranger to them, plus I've always worked on my own motorbikes/cars so I know a bit about engines, but I have to say with some things on the boat I wouldn't have had a clue about without this/similar forums.

So last week after looking for nearly 5 months I finally found a boat in my price range and with the spec that I wanted, a 1993 bayliner classic 1600 with a 1995 force 120 outboard. Now I know these are renowned for being a fairly "cheap" pairing, and many people on this forum and others have a strong dislike for the force engines, but after a lot of reading I came to the decision that this was such a simple engine that even if things do go wrong I should be able to do 95% of the labour myself (leaving room for bits that need special tools). Plus the previous owner had all the receipts for a full service only 6 months ago, and it was the only boat I really fell for that was in my price range, so the decision was made, mock me if you will ;) I plan to look after her well, I've already fitted a voltmeter to track charging, and I've got a temp sensor/guage and a tachometer on the way to try to keep on top of the engines health as best I can.

Anyway, I managed to get the boat in the water for the first time yesterday (at a local tidal river/estuary), and launched/started etc all fine. On its first application of power though I noticed quite a bit of play in the engine (i.e. prop moved toward transom under positive throttle). Once underway, the movement in the engine was very little and the steering quite stable, but I throttled down again and did some investigation, and it appeared to move quite a bit when knocked into reverse as well. I also noticed that when rapidly reducing power the boat would turn slightly. With the boat back on dry land I wobbled the engine by hand and could feel a lot of play. After doing some reading I found that it is likely the upper & lower engine mounts that have perished and need replacing.

Looking on this site and similar ones for parts I cannot seem to find the upper mounts anywhere on the parts diagrams. I've found the lower mounts (under the driveshaft housing diagram/section), but not the uppers. EDIT - typical, I've now immediately found them listed under the exhaust plate section!

So, long story short (apologies if I went on too long :laugh:), my question is has anyone ever replaced the mounts on a 95 force 120 that could shine some light on what needs to be done? I know the block needs to be removed to get to the upper mounts on quite a lot of engines and I am prepared to do that if necessary (I'd rather not of course, but it would give me a chance to check the crank/seals/pistons etc). EDIT - Now that I've found the engine mounts on the parts diagram I'm now pretty sure I'll have to remove the block, but again if anyone's done this before I would very much appreciate any advice.

Many thanks in advance to all you lovely knowledgeable people :D
 

SkiDad

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jul 18, 2010
Messages
1,518
If this is a 16' boat a 120 is overpowered. Has this boat been run in salt water ?
 

Frosty1308

Cadet
Joined
Mar 20, 2017
Messages
11
I am aware that the 120 wasn't designed for this boat and is a bit too big, however I have had it in the water and its attitude both statically and on the plane seems good. I don't particularly want to repower it unless I have to, so I'm just going to be careful with it for now.

I believe it has been run in salt water. Most of my own use will also be either brackish (river/estuary) or salt water. Are you thinking of the corrosion factor on the mounts?
 

jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
17,923
A motor that's been ran in salt water is a lot harder to take apart.
Especially the mid section and transom area.
Can be done but not an easy thing to do.

Most motor mounts parts will be used parts. E-bay maybe Craigslist.
​Boatsdotnet might have the upper mount and lower. about 180$

​A list of the part numbers would help a lot. or add pics.
​You can't post pics on here until you have 5 posts but photo bucket will load here.



As far as checking the motor for seals and pistons etc.
​A compression test will tell a lot about a motor.

Too much "messin" can cause lots of problems.
 

Frosty1308

Cadet
Joined
Mar 20, 2017
Messages
11
Hi Jerry, your advice is much appreciated!

I hadn't really considered the added difficulty of saltwater corrosion on the nuts/bolts/joints etc.. I don't want to take apart anything that I don't absolutely have to, as I very much agree that messing around too much can really screw things up, if it aint broke don't fix it!

You are right with the parts supplier, I had already checked there and you are almost exact on the price as well ;) Unfortunately they don't seem to list them on this here.

I'm not sure it will allow me to post this, but here is the link to the parts diagram for the upper mounts (part #4, 44344 2) http://www.**********/parts/search/Me...ATE/parts.html and here is the diagram for the lower mounts (part #10, 44343) http://www.**********/parts/search/Me...ING/parts.html

EDIT - as suspected these links get screwed up, if you replace the %2A%2A bit with boatsdotnet however it sorts it out.

The lower mounts look fairly accessible so I'm not too worried there (other than finding very corroded bolts etc :facepalm:). My main question is what do I have to take apart to get to the upper mounts? I'm not sure how much of the powerhead needs to be taken apart to lift it off the exhaust plate enough to change the upper mounts. Ideally of course I could leave everything (head/pistons/electrics/even carbs) in place and just unbolt and lift the powerhead off the exhaust plate, change the mounts, replace the gasket and be done. That's the optimist in me talking. The pessimist/realist says I'm going to have a long and frustrating weekend.

I would just leave it, but I really don't like the amount of play in the engine. I'll try to get some pictures/video up later on after work.
 
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jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
17,923
Sounds like it needs to be done.
​Get a torch and some PB Blaster.
​I use a comb of trans fluid and acetone in a spray bottle.

​Weekend?? you ARE an optimist aren't you??
 

Frosty1308

Cadet
Joined
Mar 20, 2017
Messages
11
Thanks a lot Jerry, and yes I am an optimist until I become better informed about the process, I think it's known as optimistic ignorance :lol:

Seriously though, do you have any knowledge of what needs to be removed to get to the upper mounts? I.e. can I lift the powerhead as a whole by disconnecting it from the exhaust plate directly, or do I need to take off other ancillaries etc to be able to get to the exhaust plate? If the former I think a weekend is quite possible, if the latter I may be wrong of course!

Generalizations from other outboard motors (I think most use very similar mounts) would even be a great help, as at the moment I don't even know where to start!

I need to get myself a repair manual I think. Side note - anyone know of a PDF that's available online?

Many thanks again :D
 

jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
17,923
The motor and exhaust tube need to come out in 1 piece.
​The exhaust tube. and adaptor plate, leave it on, that saves you a gasket and the screws usually 1 will twist off.

​The rear cover and then the plenum under the carbs(air feed) need to come off.
​There is a shift rod that has a locking nut on it(under the carb), it needs to come off. before the drive is removed.
​The drive comes off.
It's easier if the carbs are off too.

Start spraying with PB Blaster now.
 

Frosty1308

Cadet
Joined
Mar 20, 2017
Messages
11
Great info jerry, it is very much appreciated! I'm away this weekend as it turns out so I'm just going to apply liberal amounts of penetrating spray over the next week, with the hope of starting on this work next weekend.

I've bought myself a service manual, though not the specific one, it covers almost all force models from 84-99 in nearly 400 pages!

Mod EDIT: Do you own the copyright for that manual? Does the place you bought it from? Link removed. As was the topic you started w the link.
 
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Frosty1308

Cadet
Joined
Mar 20, 2017
Messages
11
Apologies to the mods, didn't occur to me about the copyright, was just trying to give back a little!
 
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