No spark on 2 cylinders =bad stator or trigger? 88 Force 85

[salmonslammer]

Well after 12 years of service my main took a puke. (Thank god for kicker motors!) Thankfully I have a spare motor in the garage so I have parts!

Swapped out both the CDI and the coil packs today.... No improvement.

In reading the manual, I see that the stator has 2 leads feeding the CDMs.... 1 goes to the top CDM (which has spark) and the bottom 2 are feed by a separate lead. I'm assuming that one is bad?

My buddy sent me some links from the forum about the horror stories of getting these things off... Yikes!

 

[Jiggz]

Based on the original wiring diagram of the 88-85HP Force, the #2 cylinder is fed from the same CD module as #1 cylinder (there are 2 ckts on each CDM) and is fed from the same power ckt from the stator feeding #1 cylinder. The #3 cylinder is fed from the second CD module and fed from the 2nd power ckt from the stator. This particular CD module has a spare ckt for the coil (since there are only three cylinders). Since you already switched from a "known" working spare CD module, it is likely the cause of the problem is the trigger signal coming off the trigger coil or it could be a magnet problem under the flywheel. Do a resistance check on the trigger wires and it should be 48-52 ohms. If you get a correct reading then you will need to check the magnets under the flywheel.

 

[salmonslammer]

Thanks for the intell..... I will meter it out in the morning. I'm already on the hunt for a flywheel puller!

 

[SkiDad]

I would say power pack issue. I know you changed them but I had this issue a few years ago and the tips at outboardigntion.com showed me how to test it. Even if you lost spark on 2 it will show you how to get one of those to fire again if 1/2 the pack is bad. If not that then it could be trigger. Won't be the stator because that will give no spark when bad. It's not that hard to pull the flywheel if you are fresh water.

 

[jerryjerry05]

What ones are firing? or not firing?

 

[salmonslammer]

The #1 (top) cylinder has spark..... #2 & 3 are both dead. In reading the manual and the outboard ignition troubleshooting pdf.... It shows the #1 CDM firing the #1 and #2 cylinders. This is what is throwing me off cause that would mean both CDM's are bad? That's why I'm thinking it has to be something upstream from the CDM's.
Hard to believe that both of them would crap out at once. Going to have my helper (wife) help me meter it out.... Well, as soon as she has her coffee!

The motor is a fresh water one.... so hopefully the fly wheel will come off!

Can I swap triggers between the 2 mtrs? The one on the boat (856x8a) has a black fly wheel, the parts motor (856x7a) has a white flywheel and different colored leads.... The CDM's were the same so I'm assuming that I can swap them without a problem.

 

[salmonslammer]

Well.... checked the stator leads and 1 and 2 was reading 190ish to150ish... and at times almost a phantom reading.
#3 and 4 were dead.... nothing on the VOM.

Fishing buddy has a puller, so wish me luck!

Should I just replace the trigger too while I've got it torn apart? It seems to go that way on this thing... Once something fails the other stuff isn't far behind! Been that way with relays, plugs, carbs and so on! Thing is my nemesis but I always win in the end!

 

[salmonslammer]

Got both the flywheels off tonight (in a freaking snow storm no less) and will look at the stators and triggers tomorrow morning and see if I can swap em out.....

Thankfully both of em came off pretty easy.... put the puller on and smacked it with Thor! Popped right off!

One thing that helped brake the castle nut was to wrap a rachet strap around the flywheel and lock it off. Worked great!

 

[salmonslammer]

Cross referenced it on crowleys web site and they are the same.... Can't believe what they wanted for em! Be almost a grand for the 2 parts! My parts motor just paid for its self 4x over!

 

[salmonslammer]

The 2 rear screws on the stator sheared off...One of the leads worked itself under it...Poof!


Are the fly wheels interchangable? One of them has more holes drilles in the rim.. Guessing ita a balancing thing?

 

[iwaterdave]

I swapped a 89 125 Force and 86 125 Force flywheel with no troubles... should be ok. Only tell ones its running.

 

[Derrick Fronckowiak]

I once pinched a stator lead under the stator (shorted it to ground). I wasn't paying attention when I was putting the stator on. It wasn't firing on two of three cylinders. I repaired the wire and it worked. My point is that you don't necessarily need to replace the stator. It doesn't mean you burned out your charge coils in your stator either, you simply grounded out one of your two charge coils on your stator. Repair your wire and re-read the resistance of your two charge coils on your stator. If the resistance is in range for both charge coil circuits and nothing is shorting to the stator frame (check for continuity between each of the four charge coil leads and the stator frame, you should get no continuity) then you should be good to go. Your stator is simply an electromagnetic induction device, the voltage isn't stepped up until it goes through the coils. Also, CHECK YOUR WIRE TERMINaLS for good solid connections, re-solder the terminals if you are in doubt.

 

[jerryjerry05]

He started this thread in April and hasn't been back???

 

[itsaboattime]

Not to hijack.....but my friend just picked up an 89 Bayliner with an 85hp Force. It will turn over, but she wont fire. I get to look at it for the first time this upcoming weekend.
I was reading this thread and hoping there would be a solution.
I guess I keep looking.

 

[Derrick Fronckowiak]

itsaboattime...first when you say it won't fire...are you getting a spark at each cylinder? If you have a timing light you can confirm it. If you don't have a timing light do you have a spark tester (you can get one for cheap at an auto parts store, maybe $10 or so). You must first establish if you are (for sure) getting a spark to the cylinder and if not which cylinders (i.e. all of them, some of them or whatever). Then go from there. Let us know. More detail needed.

 

[jerryjerry05]

itsaboatime you should start a new thread not hijack the older dead ones.
​Use the search function and you might find what you need.