Cleaning Turbochargers

Divergirl

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Hi All,
Just replaced the whole starboard turbocharger on the Volvo Penta TAMD74P-B diesel. Upon sea trial we noticed the port turbo was lagging behind the new SB turbo a tad so the tech said it probably needs to be cleaned. I asked what that entailed and he answered that it needed to be removed and taken to the shop but, I thought I read an article about a product that can be used to clean a turbo without removal. Anyone have any knowledge on this and/or any suggestions and advice?

"tanks",
Divergirl
 

alldodge

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Hi me again :D

I don't think cleaning the turbo will do much good. Reason behind my thinking is the SB turbo was worn out, housing was eroded and waste gate in bad shape. When a turbo housing wears the gap between the vanes and the housing gets larger. When those gaps increase the turbo needs to spin faster to produce the amount of pressure the engine needs.

When the turbo spins faster it can reach an over speed issue even for the turbo. This over speed condition will cause the turbo to eroded and bearings to be damaged. Turbos do have a max rpm and that is usually around 10K rpms, cannot say what VP design is.

My thought is you need another turbo and I know you don't want to hear that. You could just run it until it gives the ghost up as the port motor did and have it done then
 

Bondo

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Ayuh,.... Welcome Aboard,..... I've never heard of havin' to "Clean" a turbo before either,....

Ya clean the air goin' through it,....

Turbos are pretty much maintenance free,...

Bolt it on, it works til it don't, then replace it,...

Just feed 'em clean air, 'n clean oil,....
 
Last edited:

rbh

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Rule-#1 -never idle a diesel motor for long periods of time.
Diesel exhaust is a sticky gas at idle, as it is not fully burnt and you will get the so called carbon build up on the impellers, this makes them heavier, and heavier makes them slower to spin up.

(If this was a HWY truck it could be dusted, but I bet it is not)

Pull it, get it cleaned and inspected,


and bring the motor up to running temperature before you shut it down
 

HT32BSX115

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Hi All,
Just replaced the whole starboard turbocharger on the Volvo Penta TAMD74P-B diesel. Upon sea trial we noticed the port turbo was lagging behind the new SB turbo a tad so the tech said it probably needs to be cleaned. I asked what that entailed and he answered that it needed to be removed and taken to the shop but, I thought I read an article about a product that can be used to clean a turbo without removal. Anyone have any knowledge on this and/or any suggestions and advice?

"tanks",
Divergirl

Howdy,

Welcome aboard!


Cleaning a turbo can mean many things. VGT (variable geometry) turbos can can be "sooted" up in the area where the individual vanes are actuated by a single plate type unison ring. The (usually stainless steel) unison ring will be sliding on the cast iron housing which can be rusty and covered with soot making it stick. That in turn makes the vanes stick in a position that reduces boost considerably (or results in overboost.......it's a real problem with the 2003-2010 Ford (IHI) Powerstroke diesels)

Your engine as near as I can tell does NOT have a Variable Geometry Turbocharger. It does appear to have a waste gate. (for controlling boost by venting either some exhaust past the turbo or venting actual boost pressure to limit maximum boost) If the waste gate is stuck OPEN, or is not closing, it will limit boost.

I thought I read an article about a product that can be used to clean a turbo without removal

There's really not much to a "regular" turbo. 1 moving part usually, turbine and compressor "wheels" spinning(very fast) on a common shaft supported by 2 bearings.

There's sometimes additional moving parts in either the wastegate or VGT system (if installed) . Those are usually operated by electric, oil or air pressure servo's

All that additional stuff can make them more complicated and there's more "stuff" to "break"

If the waste gate is sticking due to rust or soot, (and causing a loss of boost) it will have to be disassembled and the rust and/or soot removed and reassembled to fix it. Unfortunately, there is no mechanic in a can for most things.

And, after they get it apart, they may find they still want to replace the turbo....

Sorry about that,

Rick
 

rbh

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And to just add, if you get a rebuild, find a shop that will balance the turbo impellers - there are two -the exhaust side and the air/intake side. They may not be be very heavy but they spin very fast.
 

Divergirl

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Keep in mind that this boat has 700 hours. I should not have to be replacing turbochargers at this point. I should be getting thousands of hours on them. The SB turbo corroded because water got through the exhaust riser and I think this was due to a gen repair done 3 years ago, I know the SB exhaust system was disassembled and reassembled several times and, I believe it was never reassembled correctly therefore, water entered the turbo and corroded everything. Before the SB turbo stopped performing, both of them were running at 2100-2200 rpm. Now the SB is new, running at 2200 rpm and the port is getting1900. Just plain strange to me.
 

HT32BSX115

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Keep in mind that this boat has 700 hours. I should not have to be replacing turbochargers at this point.
Yeah. 700hrs is nothing on a Turbo.

If you're getting water up into the exhaust system, that needs to be fixed pronto!
 

alldodge

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You bring up a good point which I overlooked from your Formula posts, 700 hours is not much, it is strange its starting right after the SB was fixed. A little water shouldn't have done that much of an issue normally, the heat would have taken care of it. I have some heavy equipment with over 6000 hours and still going strong, but I'm inland. Salt air does some bad things to metal. I'm a bit skeptic but it does sound like you have a company which knows their stuff, but also is high priced.

It could be turbo/waste gate, fuel pressure/restiction, exhaust restriction, intake restriction (inner cooler/air filter). For the shop to go straight to the turbo before checking testing, kind of gives me the impression of a WAG.
 

HT32BSX115

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I wouldn't expect a diesel (Turbo or NA) to have reversion issues, so I might also be looking at the original installation and the distance between the static waterline and the top of the exhaust riser. If the installation places the waterline close to the top of the riser, inclement weather, waves etc may have "sloshed" some water more than once over the hump and into the turbo where it would sit until the engine is restarted. If it happened at a dock or mooring, corrosive seat water would sit there until the engine was run again.
 

Divergirl

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No, no water coming in anywhere in the engine room of this boat. The SB, which was just repaired, had the exhaust system disassembled and reassembled several times for a gen repair, not the port. When the tech was diagnosing the SB turbo problem, he look at and took pictures of the port compression wheel and it appeared to be clean as a whistle. It is just that it is lagging behind the new SB turbo now at 1800-1900 rpm.
 

HT32BSX115

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No, no water coming in anywhere in the engine room of this boat. The SB, which was just repaired, had the exhaust system disassembled and reassembled several times for a gen repair, not the port. When the tech was diagnosing the SB turbo problem, he look at and took pictures of the port compression wheel and it appeared to be clean as a whistle. It is just that it is lagging behind the new SB turbo now at 1800-1900 rpm.


Well, they won't know anything until they determine fuel delivery, boost pressure, wastegate position, exhaust temp, etc...

If you don't have it, you can get familiar with some of the engine operating specifications from the following Volvo manual.
http://www.kb-kbh.dk/shipslib/motorer/volvo/volvo_penta_tamd61a-72j-a_wm_technicaldata.pdf
 

Howard Sterndrive

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on some of those giant low speed diesels, they use walnut shells to clean the hot wheel. I remember seeing engines with a little cup on the side of the exhaust manifold where you would put the shells and then open a flap and they would blast it.
I wouldn't try it on your little Volvo though. lol.
 

Divergirl

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Speaking of boost pressure.....I have a brand new boost pressure sensor gauge(?) which was returned to me yesterday by the guy I "fired" who was originally working on the SB turbo problem. As my boat did not need this part, I am going to try to sell it however, I thought the Volvo packaging would have the part number on it and all I see is 48 cm3 and then someone wrote in magic marker 881 708 on the box....anyone know the correct part number so I can advertise it?
 

HT32BSX115

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on some of those giant low speed diesels, they use walnut shells to clean the hot wheel. I remember seeing engines with a little cup on the side of the exhaust manifold where you would put the shells and then open a flap and they would blast it.
I wouldn't try it on your little Volvo though. lol.
That probably works good with a large diameter slow turning turbine.......
But on one turning over 100,000 RPM .....There might be fireworks!
 

alldodge

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Probably need a pic of the gauge. cm3 (one cubic centimeter) = 1ml (milliliter), so were looking at volume not pressure in most cases.
 

HT32BSX115

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If that's a BOOST pressure gage, it would read in KPa, BAR or PSI (or maybe all three)
 

Ozdownunder

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Hi, I have read and used a simple trick for variable vane turbos, take off the exhaust side hose/pipe just attached to the rear of the turbo, spray regular foam oven cleaner into the exhaust side of the turbo, fill the whole exhaust side of the turbo.

Do the exhaust hose back up and wait for twenty mins, start engine, don't worry the engine will smoke and splutter, but will run fine in a short time, the exhaust gasses will throw out the oven cleaner out. The oven cleaner breaks down the carbon build up.

My engine was also 750hrs, my mistake was always running it between 1400 - 2000 RPM
Diesel engines with turbos like a hard times so run your engine harder, its not doing it any good being easy on her and it dose more damage

Hope that helps
 

Magnus W

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First, are you absolutely sure that the turbos are identical? You don't specify that you bought it from a Penta distributor and even if you did, sometimes ? especially on older engines ? parts (and complete assys) get replaced by other similar but not identical ones.

Second, you state that the older turbo comes into boost later. Based on what? Engine rpm vs boost gauge or seat of the pants? Regardless you should verify engine rpm by swapping the tacs from starboard to port and vice versa (and boost gauges too if you have 'em). Same with EGT-gauges.

But to reply the initial question, yes you can clean the turbo when installed. On the intake side you can gently spray a degreaser directly on the compressor wheel. Engine should be idling and turbo spinning. Don't use to much or you'll fog and stall the engine with potential risk of damaging it. Then spray with clean water using a spray bottle.

On the exhaust side you need to remove exhaust in order to gain access to the turbine. Mechanically remove deposits such as soot and rust but be very careful so that you don't damage (i.e. bend, scratch) the blades on the turbine wheel or the surface of the turbine housing. There should be a small gap between the blades and the housing to allow for the blades to elongate from temperature and g-forces.
 
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