VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

[Dolfan0925]

Got this VHF for christmas
http://www.iboats.com/Standard-Ecli...6688674--**********.630523962--view_id.370695

Is this antenna ok?
http://www.amazon.com/TRAM-1600-HC-...P1NO/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1293554542&sr=8-3

Or do you have another you could recommend that's about the same price. It's probably never going to be used, and I'm never going offshore with it. But better safe than sorry.

Thanks,
Tony

 

[1fishbone]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Hopefully you'll never NEED it.
I would go with Shakespeare, they last!
I've had this one on my T top for about 6 years, looks and works like new.
http://www.amazon.com/Shakespeare-5...3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1293562285&sr=1-3

 

[keninaz]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

The antenna you are talking about might be OK but around salt water I would not have a metal antenna.
And, at typical VHF freqs I would not have any antenna that does not state it does not need a good ground plane.
Many boats are fiberglass and without a good metal ground plane or at least an antenna designed for work without it you could have performance problems.
Fiberglass antennas work great around water. I have had a few Shakespeare brand units and never had a problem with them.
If you are getting a full sized antenna make sure the thing lays down. It's easier on the unit in really rough waters and sometimes needed if you have to go under bridges or into trees along the shore and such.
Just some ideas for thought.

 

[Dolfan0925]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

So, that Shakespeare one is stainless steel, not fiberglass.

I'm confused.

 

[dockwrecker]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

The Shakepeare antennas are fiberglass. I prefer the output of their premium models over the cheap ones they sell. A radio ain't much good if no one can hear you.

 

[keninaz]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Yes, I have never seen a metal Shakepeare.

 

[sasto]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Hey Dolfan, I had an antenna simular to that one..I ran the St. Lucie River from White City to the Atlantic in a small center console..used average of 30 hrs a week..Never had a problem. The problem I had was the people on the boat using them as a handrail. (good friends I have, huh?) Bent them, broke them. I went thru several "good" antennas before going to the "no name". The choice is yours. Depends on what you want to spend. (Check out the discount marine store in Ft. Pierce, they carry Shakespeare and others)

Good Luck....neighbor.

 

[NYBo]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Those short whip antennas are best mounted up high, on a radar arch or sailboat mast. Height is the main determinant of range, all other things being equal.

The Shakepeare antennas are fiberglass. I prefer the output of their premium models over the cheap ones they sell. A radio ain't much good if no one can hear you.

Yes, I have never seen a metal Shakepeare.

Better take a better look at the linked product. It's a stainless steel Shakespeare whip antenna.

http://www.amazon.com/Shakespeare-5...3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1293562285&sr=1-3

 

[keninaz]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Yes height can be important. VHF is line of site and the horizon is some 16 miles or so but a sail mast is not going to give you that much more range.

 

[jhebert]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

It is too bad you bought a VHF Marine Band Radio with DSC-rating for only SC-101. It will soon be against to the law to manufacture, import, sell, or install those radios. They are obsolete. You should have purchased a VHF Marine Band radio rated for Class-D DSC. Perhaps you can get your money back.

The antenna you mention is unknown to me. I do not like the design of its mounting. There is a much better antenna of that size made by GAM ELECTRONICS. I much prefer it to the antenna you have chosen. I made a careful study of all antennas available before choosing the GAM ELECTRONICS SS-2. See

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/VHFAntenna.html

 

[Dolfan0925]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Those short whip antennas are best mounted up high, on a radar arch or sailboat mast. Height is the main determinant of range, all other things being equal.




Better take a better look at the linked product. It's a stainless steel Shakespeare whip antenna.

Ya thanks. It specifies what that antenna is made of and it's made of a few things, none non-metallic.

So what's the difference between Shakespeare metal antennas and non-Shakespeare that makes Shakespeare seem to be able to overcome the ground plane issue?

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Mind if I ask what kind of boat you have? where you plan on mounting this antenna? Fiberglass antennas are more versatile, they can be manufactured so that they do not need a ground plane but more importantly they can be manufactured with "Gain". Gain can improve the range of the radio. They are also generally tougher then simple metal whips which makes them preferable on boats since alot like you will only use it when they need it. Once you have your radio installed I would highly suggest you check it with a VSWR meter, a local radio shop will do it for you for cheap, this will confirm your system is operating properly. The problem with radios is that if the antenna system is shorted the radio can be damaged.

 

[wire2]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Ya thanks. It specifies what that antenna is made of and it's made of a few things, none non-metallic.

So what's the difference between Shakespeare metal antennas and non-Shakespeare that makes Shakespeare seem to be able to overcome the ground plane issue?

It's not so much the brand, but the design.
A ? wave vertical antenna needs a ground plane to achieve a low VSWR (which in turn assures maximum transmit power, best receiver sensitivity).

A dipole, and a co-axial antenna are 2 that don't, they work just fine in open air. They "supply" the other ? wave, to total ? wave.

 

[Boatist]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

If your ever plan to use the DSC Distress button then I would take the radio back. The Class SC101 can not be sold in the USA after March 2011. After that date only Class D and higher can be sold.
The Class D DSC Radio have a seperate channel 70 for DSC operation and some software Changes to make it work better.

The style antenna you have is really designed fo sailboats Mast heads or high up on a radar arch. Most VHF antennas are 1/2 wave and do not require a ground plane. The ones that do should say requires a ground plane in the instructions.

I always want a top quality like a Shakespears 5225. Bad antennas account for 80 percent of the radio problems in my opinion. There is a big difference in the construction of antenna.
I do not know much about you type but in 8 foot fiberglass style many antenna are bad in a year or two of use in rough waters.

A 8 foot antenna with a top 11 foot above the water has a range of just under 5 miles plus the range of the other station.
So just under 10 miles is a very common Boat to Boat range.
Boat to Coast Guard here is often over 80 miles due to the Coast Guards antenna being mounted 3000 feet high on top of a mountain.
Coast Guards task is to be able to recieve a 1 watt signal on channel 70 the DSC channel for the entire Coast of the USA out to 30 miles. The System in not complete for the entire USA yet but getting closer.

 

[Outsider]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

If your ever plan to use the DSC Distress button ..

DSC is fully functional in all respects on the Eclipse. Going from SC-101 to Class D (for the domestic recreational user) will be a non-event. Something is different about the 'D', but no one will notice except for the cost ...

 

[jhebert]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

DSC is fully functional in all respects on the Eclipse. Going from SC-101 to Class D (for the domestic recreational user) will be a non-event. Something is different about the 'D', but no one will notice except for the cost ...

Radios rated only for RTCM SC-101 do not have any DSC functionality except for sending a distress call. They are really obsolete. They were only permitted in the U.S. as a way to introduce DSC radios at a lower cost.

The current cost differential between an obsolete radio and a Class-D radio is close to zero.

I do not see much value in encouragement of purchase of obsolete radios. The manufacturers are no longer making these radios. Some big distributors are trying to clear out their inventory before more boaters become aware that the RTCM SC-101 DSC radios will soon be outlawed for sale in the U.S.

A Class-D radio will work better. Even if there were a small difference in price--perhaps $25--it would be better to get the newer radio in preference to an obsolete radio. It does not seem smart to buy a radio 90-days before its sale will be outlawed by federal regulations.

 

[Outsider]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

Radios rated only for RTCM SC-101 do not have any DSC functionality except for sending a distress call.

Well, the 14 pages in the Eclipse manual dealing with DSC functions would seem to contradict that premise. Now I'm sure Class D is oh, so much better, but I'm also sure 95% of users aren't even conversant with what the Eclipse will do. VHF units that don't have DSC are obsolete, SC-101 merely denotes a unit no longer approved by FCC. Kinda like incandescent bulbs, they won't be obsolete just because the government says they can't be sold any longer ...

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

I agree with you Outsider for the most part, the part I disagree with you is where you say the radio is obsolete like an incandescent light bulb. The reason is that the USCG requires this radio upgrade and if your found to have obsolete equipment they can remove you from the water where as if you have a incan. light bulb you can use it until you have to replace it. Now this is only a concern in ocean going boats but it is still a concern.

 

[Boatist]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

SC101 radios will still work. My point was they should be telling people about the change.
The Class D radio has a seperate channel for channel 70 and is always monitored. The DSC distress call is sent in about 1/3 of a second. Will a scanned channel 70 here that call? Also they have corrected some problems with the SC101 radio. DSC rescue 21 will be good out to 30 miles off shore. So if your 30 miles off shore and you hear a DSC call from another boat 10 miles farther out and a land base station does not respond does the SC101 radio relay the correct information to the Coast Guard. Many apperently were relaying the call but instead of sending the other boats MMSI and position they were sending their own MMSI and Position so the sinking boat message never got to the Coast Guard. This is the type of thing that has been corrected.

On non commerical boats a radio is not required at all but if your going to have one why not have one that can improve your saftey and the saftey of others?

 

[jhebert]

Re: VHF+Antenna, this a good combo?

The good advice on VHF Marine Band radios is to recommend a Class-D DSC radio. This advice complies with the FCC regulations which will take effect in March 2011, and with the recommendation of the US Coast Guard. The USCG has been recommending Class-D radios for years. The sunset regulations on SC-101 have been posted for years. There is no surprise here. The sunset date is just about to occur. That is why retailers want to sell off their remaining inventory.

If the FCC is going to ban the import, manufacture, sale, and installation of SC-101 radios, it seems reasonable to conclude there must be something better about Class-D radios that warrants their adoption and use. To argue against this is to imply that the FCC and the USCG don't know much about VHF Marine Band radios, and we ought to ignore them in favor of internet advice.

There is no doubt that existing SC-101 radios will still continue to function after March 2011 as well as they did before, but why would you go out of your way to buy a new one?