Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

Status
Not open for further replies.

D-Train

Recruit
Joined
Oct 15, 2009
Messages
3
New forum member and boat owner here. I recently bought a 99 Smoker Craft Ultima 178. It's a walk through windshield fish/ski style boat. I had it inspected by a marina and they told me the bilge switch was bad but otherwise in great condition especially motor. No problem, easy to replace a switch and I wanted to take ownership right away so I didn't bother asking the seller to fix it. Unfortunately I need help :redface:

First off is there a good general boat and/or boat electrical book that is good for someone with my style of boat?

I'm not new to electrical work and have decent working knowledge of home wiring but am new to the DC world. I found an exact replacement McGill switch. It's a 3 pin lighted on/off. On the existing switch first pin has three black wires, second pin one red, third one brown.

I'm assuming...
1 brown wire pin = bilge
1 red wire pin = +12V
3 black wire pin = ground

Is this most likely correct? What could the 3 black wires represent/lead to? Would one be coming back from the bilge and one going to the battery? What about the third?

Since I bought the same switch, I just connected the pins to the same terminals and turned on the switch. The light on the switch seems to be coming on intermittently - 1 second on, 5 seconds off, etc. It does so without moving the wires so I'm not sure if loose wiring is suspect. The bilge does not come on at all.

I looked at the bilge pump. It's an Attwood v625. It has a single brown and black wire connected via splices. I don't see a float switch anywhere.

Is the bilge and switch a typical setup for my style of boat?

What would be next steps for troubleshooting?

Thanks for the help. I'm sure these are newbie questions as this is my first boat.
 

rndn

Commander
Joined
May 20, 2007
Messages
2,323
Re: Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

Welcome to the forum!!:):)
Are you getting 12 volts to the switch and to the pump? Take a meter and find out. If you don't have a meter you could always rig a test light but meters are really not expensive.
 

Silvertip

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
28,758
Re: Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

DC wiring is very little different than AC. +12 volts (the line) feeds a switch, out of the switch on the "load" side to the hot side of the device. The ground side of the device goes to ground. Same as in AC wiring. The ground terminal on the switch is ONLY for the internal light in the switch so one of those black wires must go to the ground buss on the fuse panel or to the negative post on the battery. The reason the light is cycling is there is a auto reset circuit breaker that is tripping, probably because the pump is stalled. On that type of switch, +12 volts must be connected to the "line" side of the switch. The brown wire (the pump feed) goes to the "load" side. If you have those reversed, the internal light will be on when the switch is off and off when the switch is on. Disconnect the brown wire, turn the switch on and see if you still get the cycling. If not, you have a stalled pump or a short in the brown wire.
 

D-Train

Recruit
Joined
Oct 15, 2009
Messages
3
Re: Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

Thanks guys.

I don't have a meter and will plan on purchasing one.

With the brown wire disconnected, the switch does stay on. How can I determine whether it could be a stalled pump or short in the wiring?

I wonder why there are three grounds connected to the switch if only one is needed for the light within the switch. Any guesses what the others are for?

The boat has been winterized now and goes into storage on Saturday. Chances are this won't be resolved this year. Are there any good marine electrical (and mechanical) books that are geared more towards the outboard fishing type of boat? I could use some reading for the offseason.
 

Silvertip

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
28,758
Re: Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

Somebody determined that this was a good ground point for other accessories when in fact it is not. You need a multitester (volt, ohm, milliammeter) to troubleshoot the system. You will also need access to the pump. You can check the pump by disconnecting the tan wire at the pump (usually a crimp type connector) and feeding 12 volts from a battery charger or the battery to the pump. It should run when wired directly. If not, it is defective or stalled.
 

Les Robb

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
435
Re: Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

DC is easy, every manual you read says disconnect the negative terminal of the battery before beginning your work. Your dash switch should be auto (through bilge switch) and manual (direct). All you want to do is provide a route from the pump back to the ground. (Negative side of the battery).

A good example of this would be to try and disconnect the positive side of the battery first. Let's say you have a wrench in your hand touching a ring and the wrench contacts any part of the grounded portion of the circuit. You can actually melt the ring while on the finger. Saw this first hand in Air Force. Explains why they use DC to arc weld. Rule #1 Remove all jewelry prior to working on electrical system.

In auto positive voltage goes to bilge switch which will complete the circuit to ground when water raises the flapper and complete the circuit, in manual you go direct to the pump and hence to ground.

Luck and hope that explains a little of it
 

D-Train

Recruit
Joined
Oct 15, 2009
Messages
3
Re: Bilge pump and/or switch troubleshooting

Completed the final steps to winterizing today and boat goes into storage tomorrow. I pulled the battery and pump and tried running the pump directly off the battery - no go. I guess I'm in the market for a new pump.

Any suggestions for replacing an Attwood v625? This is a 17' aluminum boat with a somewhat deeper hull.

Suppose I wanted to add a float switch. Is it more common to wire it off a on/off/auto switch or ok to wire it directly off the battery and keep the new on/off switch? If directly off the battery, I assume I'd need an inline fuse.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2013
Messages
7
I have a Johnson 1600 (I think) but the label is unreadable. This is nota newer model with a screw on top, it's a 2994 vintage. If it helps, the cap is red and the discharge is straight and not angled up. The basic question, are the bases interchangeable, if not are there some in this size range that are?
Going a step further, which bilge pumps have an internal float switch. This has a smart float with no moving parts but I have only a 8" access hole in front of the motor to get this done.
​Thanks
 
Last edited:

GA_Boater

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
May 24, 2011
Messages
49,038
Gonna close this 6+ year old thread. Just me. please don't reply to old, inactive threads. Start a new topic, maybe some member has a time machine to zip up to 2994 to see if Johnson is still in business. :D
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top