Attaching a transducer to a listing boat

[Joolz]

Just got me a Humminbird 596c HD fish finder, the 640x640 5" screen model with down imaging, duo beam and all the fancy stuff. Purchased from a local boater that bought a new boat that already had a fish finder installed, so he sold me his old rig as a complete set - which means it needs to be installed to my 17' boat.

I understand that mounting the transducer to the boat should be done as vertically true as possible. But here lies the problem: my boat lists a bit to the side (steering wheel side/starboard). Before I attempt to install the transducer I wanted to inquire with you folks here as to how I should go about doing this. As in, do I mount it in a slight angle in order to compensate for the boat's slightly off angle while on the water? Or should I try to address the listing before doing any installation?

About the listing: I suspect the reason for the listing could due to poor weight distribution. Even with wife and kids sitting on the port side (some 40 lbs heavier than me in total) the boat still seems to be listing a bit to the right side. is this a common complaint or should I look into possibly doing some weight distribution fixes? For instance, on the right side of the boat is the steering wheel, the battery, the electric troller motor. I suppose I could try and move the battery to the port side, although I'd only do this if you folks think it'd help. The portable gas tank is always placed as far to the port side as possible, on the opposite side of the battery. And it still has a very slight list to the right.

The pic below shows me on a solo run, suppose it's expected it would list a bit given my weight (a mere 65k/150 lbs). It also shows the electric motor that likely weights a good 10kg, and hidden down further, the marine battery. Wondering if this is common? If so, do I then mount the transducer a couple of degrees off centre to compensate?

This may seem like a very basic question but I am a noobie to boating and could use all the basic coaching as you're willing to offer.

 

[Fed]

Have you tried trimming the motor out a bit?

Does the steering pull or favour one side over the other?

 

[redneck joe]

Does it sit even withnnonone in it?

 

[David Young]

Looks like you have 50+ gallons of water under your floor. To me anyway and i'm no expert.

 

[roscoe]

My boat lists also, due to weight distribution when I redesigned her, and a kicker motor.

I have a new Humminbird Helix 7 DI installed.

The list doesn't seem to make any difference.

 

[Joolz]

Hi, sorry for the delay in replying, I didn't know there were replies to this post (thought I'd get a notification email).
Fed: not sure what you mean by trimming the motor out. Do you mean elevating it a bit? Cause I typically lower it as far as it will go while on the water. If it should be raised a bit, I'd like to know (again, total newbie here)
As for steering pull: I never noticed it but will test it out next time we're on the lake.

Redneck Joe: I can't tell for sure but in one instance I do believe I noticed a bit of a list with no one inside. Will have to confirm this next time I'm on the lake.

David Young: ouch, that's scary. How can I check for this? It is possible, I'd think, based on the pics I just posted below. As you can see the previous owner did a fair bit of beaching and the keel shows wear. I used a needle to see if it went through the fibreglass but it didn't, so what appears to be holes aren't, at least as far as penetrating them with a needle. Appears to be whole but for all I know water could be getting in. A few days ago I bought a keel guard to address this (haven't installed it yet). Boat has been left "to dry" without the plug since October, so would any water in there have dried by now? Boat does seem awfully heavy. I truly would like to know how to ensure there's no water inside, so hope someone can assist me with this. Can take more pics if needed, just please advice what I have to do. Thanks for the help.

 

[JASinIL2006]

The fiberglass in that second picture looks a bit punky to me... if it were just the gelcoat scratched off, I might just apply the keel guard and be done with it. Those darker areas with cracks radiating from them don't look good. I'm sure expect others will chime in, but my thought would be repair those areas first. Especially if your boat is feeling heavier than you'd expect... that sounds like possibly wet foam.

 

[David Young]

Do you have soft spots in your floor? If you read in the Boat Restoration, Building, and Hull Repair section on this Forum you'll read where people 'drill' holes in their floors to find the foam is soaked with water.

They're people on the Forum that know how to do this the 'right way'. I 'don't'

 

[Joolz]

The fiberglass in that second picture looks a bit punky to me...

Just now I cleaned the area with alcohol and tried to form a tight seal with my mouth and blow into it. Unfortunately the distance between the keel and the trailer is too small. Managed to blow into the first hole (top pic) and it didn't go through. Not a very scientific way to tell but I'm sure if I was able to blow into it that it'd be very telling. Not sure it'd be wise to try and jack the boat up a few inches off the trailer for my head to fit in - wife kinda needs me to stick around to help raise the kids. So unless someone can think of a way for me to test that second hole for breach, we may not know how well it's sealing.

This boat has always been garaged and/or tightly covered. There were no soft spots or any sign of water damage on the floor, which feels solid. If water got into the foam in the hull I wouldn't know how it got there. That keel does look suspicious though.

Here's what I did 1 hour ago: lowered the front of the boat's trailer as much as I could to level it up and watched for water to come out of the suspicious damage in the keel. Nothing came out. Again, not a very scientific test but I suppose a good sign so far. Will have to take a closer look at the info here on how to check the foam for water.

 

[Fed]

Do you mean elevating it a bit? Cause I typically lower it as far as it will go while on the water. If it should be raised a bit, I'd like to know (again, total newbie here)

Yes, start off with the motor fully down then as you're driving along slowly start raising it with the button on your controller handle and see if it levels out.

 

[JASinIL2006]

Just now I cleaned the area with alcohol and tried to form a tight seal with my mouth and blow into it. Unfortunately the distance between the keel and the trailer is too small. Managed to blow into the first hole (top pic) and it didn't go through. Not a very scientific way to tell but I'm sure if I was able to blow into it that it'd be very telling. Not sure it'd be wise to try and jack the boat up a few inches off the trailer for my head to fit in - wife kinda needs me to stick around to help raise the kids. So unless someone can think of a way for me to test that second hole for breach, we may not know how well it's sealing.

This boat has always been garaged and/or tightly covered. There were no soft spots or any sign of water damage on the floor, which feels solid. If water got into the foam in the hull I wouldn't know how it got there. That keel does look suspicious though.

Here's what I did 1 hour ago: lowered the front of the boat's trailer as much as I could to level it up and watched for water to come out of the suspicious damage in the keel. Nothing came out. Again, not a very scientific test but I suppose a good sign so far. Will have to take a closer look at the info here on how to check the foam for water.

If you had a big enough hole or crack that you could blow air into the hull, I think you'd have a really big problem!

 

[Scott Danforth]

I agree, the second picture shows two areas of concern, and what appears to be wet areas of a crack thru the keel. there is no way you would be able to blow thru them.

I would do a serious inspection of the keel, as well as a few test drills into stringers and your transom. I would almost put money on it that your boat will be getting a restoration shortly

 

[Joolz]

Wow this is getting scary. But if I must face the music then the sooner the better. Can you or someone please elaborate a bit on what I have to do? As in, what my next step should be? Already have booked our camping trip at the lake 3 months from now and yesterday I brought home a two person tube for the boys, hope not to disappoint the kids if we don't have a working boat then.

 

[ondarvr]

To answer your first question. Don't worry about your boat not sitting perfectly level when it comes to mounting the transducer, it will never be perfect when boating, but will most likely be close enough. Mount it the best you can and see how it works, it will probably work fine, if not, adjust it until it does. This assumes you have no other issues and it's just how things are positioned in the boat that's making it list.

Next. How your motor is trimmed will have no effect on what you're doing, so don't worry about that.

Third. The glass on the keel doesn't look good in the pic, you need to fix it before putting on the Keel Guard. The foam could easily be soaked, but there's no way to tell unless you check it. Soaked foam can create all kinds of issues, and the boat listing is one.

 

[Joolz]

Thank you ondarvr for bringing this thread back on track: good to know I don't need to be super precise with the transducer. Will just install as straight as possible. After all this duo beam gives you up to a 60 degree angle, sure that being off a bit would still give me plenty to see on the screen.

If I may go back off topic: including a new pic, please refer to it. As I need to get to the bottom of this I just went to the boat armed with an utility knife and a small screw driver. Removed the loose stuff from the both the "holes" shown in the pic first posted above. First of all, I should clarify that the poor lighting made it look like an actual hole. But as I scraped off the loose stuff I could see that it was only superficial. Starting with the bottom hole (the uglier looking one) I was only able to remove about 1mm of the loose/damaged fibreglass before I hit solid glass. Unless there are microscopic cracks that's allowing water to get inside, I'm satisfied that it is just a superficial wound.

The "top" hole was a bit deeper, about 2.5mm deep (sorry, I don't do imperial for you not familiar with metric but it's less than 1/8"). As seen in the pic, I only removed the loose material directly surrounding the worst spot. Once I hit solid glass I stopped scraping. Pressing into the hole with a flathead screwdriver I could see that it was firm. I'm satisfied at this too is just superficial and that there is no breaching, other than possible microscopic cracks (but I'm only speculating, I don't know much about fibreglass). However seeing how this is about twice as deep as the other "hole" I have to wonder if its integrity has been compromised.

What is the typical thickness of a keel? Can I assume it's about 1/4" on a 17' 1986 boat? Wondering now if this damage to be just superficial or if it in fact could be allowing water to get in. Suppose I won't know till further inspection is done like drilling the floor to look for water. But as far as the keel is concerned, do you now think I'm safe to go ahead and slap that 3M keel guard on? I do realize it is hard to tell by looking at pics but so far I think we're making progress. And again, a big thanks to all that has taken the time to share your inputs.

 

[ondarvr]

In the pics the glass still looks white at the bottom of the hole, white glass means it's fractured and needs to be replaced. White glass can allow water to migrate through it, I'm not saying it is, only that it can, it all depends on how thick the glass is and how deep it's fractured. Even if you knew how thick the hull was supposed to be it wouldn't help because each hull is made individually and they vary a great deal.

 

[Joolz]

Ok so I suppose the only way to know if water has made its way in would be to drill holes and check the foam in the hull? Would that be the next obvious step? If so and you have a handy guide that you could point me to, that'd be great. Never attempted this before.

Either way it now sounds like I'd have to repair the glass in the keel. Hope this isn't as scary a job as it may seem at first. Never worked with fibreglass before but that's the thing about boating isn't it, all sorts of things to learn before you even hit the water.
Thanks for the help. Would very much like to keep this boat for the long haul. It suits us so well. If these are necessary steps to ensure it lives a long life, so be it. Dreading what I may find inside the hull but it sounds like I may need to find out soon.