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Replacing Bayliner Capri stringers/deck with pix

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  • #31
    Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

    rngale

    Sounds like you have a good deal of experience in boat repair or building, it's always good to have more expertise here.


    Greenwood boat panels are PT plywood designed for the marine industry and they work very well, they use the previous type of treatment and are dry when you get them. Making foam panels can work well, the problem is it can be time consuming, very expensive, will require more expertise than most here have to do it correctly and will be beyond what's needed for this type of repair.

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    • #32
      Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

      once you get the floor up be sure to check the motor mounts after the stringers. I don't remember what prompted me to cut mine open but I found one rotted to mulch(and I replaced it with the engine still in the boat).

      The three things to keep in mind about pressure treated wood are It warps, it's hard to find a stright piece and if you do it'll warp if you look at it. I used some 1/2 pt for my project and had some parts that had to be scrapped due to warpage. I used 3/4 subfloor t&g for the deck in my BLiner and it's solid. It's a little more wieght but it's not much
      "Story with me is put him in the wall"

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      • #33
        Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

        ondarvr,

        Do the greenwood panel manufacturers gaurantee that u can laminte to them without a large risk of delamination and failure? Or are they designed to be installed as is with out encapsulation?

        As far as foam panels go that was just another option. The same thing can be done with balsa core, marine ply, of even ext grade if so desired. The beauty of a small layup table also allows for making hatches as well by hot glueing stips to form a lip and u can make the radius with regual modeling clay. Im not trying to confuse anyone here, but if interested in learning how its done professionaly, im more than happy to talk you guys through it.

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        • #34
          Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

          Originally posted by rngale View Post
          Pt wood of any type in a boat is not a good Choice. The chemicals in it are toxic to start with, it prevents polyester and epoxy resin from forming a good bond and its heavy....
          I have to disagree with your here. Over the years many iboats member have done tests with PT vs regular ply. The PT held the poly or epoxy resin with no problems. In fact, if you search these forums, I doubt you will find one post where someone is complaining or stating that their glass work fell off or loosened from PT wood. In fact, many manufacturers have now switched to pressure treated wood in their boats where water is an issue (stringers, bulkheads, transom). As far as PT being heavy, that is most likely due to the high water content after manufacture. If you buy from indoor lumberyards, PT is usually dry. And regarding the toxic chemicals, after you install the PT wood, it is encapsulated in polyester or epoxy, so the average boater will not have bare skin contact with it anyway. If its safe enough to build deck floors and railings, and kids swingsets from, its safe for use in the floor of your boat.

          I think the references you make are from years ago when people slapped resin on wet PT and it did not stick well. Now everyone knows to be sure the PT is dry before use.

          It would be foolish to not consider using PT in a rebuild.

          Regards,

          Mark
          sigpic 1985 Bayliner 1600 Capri Cuddy, 1965 MFG Niagara Custom. >> MFG Video<<. >> MFG Project<< >>Bayliner Hard Top Project<< >>Bayliner Repower Project<<

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          • #35
            Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

            One other aspect of PT I wanted to mention...

            I have read over and over that stainless fasteners should not be used on PT lumber. In 1995 I built a large deck on my house using all pt lumber and stainless steel screws. A year ago when I started reading the warnings in this forum about stainless and PT, I went out to my deck and removed a few screws to inspect them. Many were not able to budge due to the floor decking having shrunk and binding on the screws, but the few I did get out showed no signs of corrosion. Thats 12 years of exposure to the outdoors in the north. So I have to say that my own personal experience with stainless and pt lumber shows that there was no corrosion whatsoever.
            sigpic 1985 Bayliner 1600 Capri Cuddy, 1965 MFG Niagara Custom. >> MFG Video<<. >> MFG Project<< >>Bayliner Hard Top Project<< >>Bayliner Repower Project<<

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            • #36
              Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

              pt ply has been known to eat alum.....other than that.....its a fine choice for boat building........the only problem is when purchased from a local home type hardware store....its really wet....hence the weight......it needs to be dryed......a long time...if you dont dry it ...it wont take resin..and it can warp when its drying.......

              if you dry it well and dont warp it......it is a fantastic material and i highly recommend it for the right curcumstances.

              but as any one can see....there are a lot of options and opinions as far as boat building.
              what the real deal is......is from the olden times the boat manufacturers used what ever they could for wood....even old pallets....and the manufacturers proved that just about anything would work....

              the truth is........that most types of wood used here on the site will far outlast the owners desire to own the boat.
              even lowly exterior grade plywood.....(tashasdaddys choice.....td is a veteran of more restos than i can count and imho....sitll one of the top restorers on this site).....once encapsulated in glass properly will last over 20 years.....done right....even 40 !

              so why split hairs? pick the wood that is in your budget and will work in the situation you are in......ie.....dont use pt on alum....and why use marine ply on a 14 foot glass boat you only want to keep for 2 years when your budget for the whole project is 15 bucks !

              heck......i ripped open my ray and found non glassed plywood sistered to rotten stringers.....with a deck thrown over it....i rescued that boat out of a farmers feild (after sitting for at least 5 years uncovered) and ran it for 8 years with out a problem !

              we...here as amatures try to do the best we can, we arent naval engineers so we just over build as best we can.....thats why the pt ply encapsulated with 72 layers of 1708 and epoxy with stainless steel bolts........and thats just the seat mounts !

              but we all just have to keep it all in perspective.....do we all want to restore the boat to better than factory new........or do we just wanna go fishin????
              if you wanna restore the boat....great.......but if we wanna go fishin!!!!!!!.
              ....i can do a deck in less than 8 hrs start to finish......and the uph and carpet in less than 10 !

              just somthing to think about before we all get to anal over detailes

              cheers
              oops
              The Hull Extension Thread
              great info on all aspects on boat building with detailed information.

              http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=234392

              IN MEMORY OF Our friend SpinnerBait_Nut LESTER WRIGHT July 31, 1953 - Nov 26, 2008 RIP

              IN MEMORY OF Our friend Tashasdaddy Robert (bob) Griffis. October 27, 1948
              November 29 2010 RIP

              Comment



              • #37
                Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                Thanks for the insight on PT wood. I've got the boat back here at the house and I'll try to post photos of what I'm trying to do and ask some more questions along with them.
                197133' Chris Craft Coho/Catalina Sedan, twin CC 327QA's, Paragon V drives. Restoration in progress1985 Bayliner Capri 1952 (19' cuddy),OMC 3.0L. Restored with the knowledge here on iBoats'70 (circa) Amphicat 6x6 AATV, future Coho tender'87 Kawasaki 650SX, '90

                Tow rig: '74 Buick LeSabre Luxus convertible 455ci cude U 4BBL factory dual exhaust

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                • #38
                  Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                  I've been tearing into it since this morning...

                  I've drilled a few holes into the stringers and they're moist...not mulch but I know they've got to be replaced.

                  I haven't removed any glass from them but they're 2''x4'' right? Are there "marine" 2x4s? And as mentioned when I replace them I need to support the hull...how do I go about doing that? Its on its trailer right now.

                  I spose I'll have to see how the transom and motor mounts are too and determine if I need to pull the motor and sterndrive
                  197133' Chris Craft Coho/Catalina Sedan, twin CC 327QA's, Paragon V drives. Restoration in progress1985 Bayliner Capri 1952 (19' cuddy),OMC 3.0L. Restored with the knowledge here on iBoats'70 (circa) Amphicat 6x6 AATV, future Coho tender'87 Kawasaki 650SX, '90

                  Tow rig: '74 Buick LeSabre Luxus convertible 455ci cude U 4BBL factory dual exhaust

                  Comment



                  • #39
                    Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                    14 plywood is stronger on its side than dimensional lumber.

                    but bud....its your boat....you can do whatever you want and use what ever you want in it. no limits
                    The Hull Extension Thread
                    great info on all aspects on boat building with detailed information.

                    http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=234392

                    IN MEMORY OF Our friend SpinnerBait_Nut LESTER WRIGHT July 31, 1953 - Nov 26, 2008 RIP

                    IN MEMORY OF Our friend Tashasdaddy Robert (bob) Griffis. October 27, 1948
                    November 29 2010 RIP

                    Comment



                    • #40
                      Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                      hmm now that I think of it that seems right since that's why there's those laminated engineered beams or whatever you call them for building construction...

                      so if I did use marine plywood for the stringers, would I put a four 1/2'' strips together to make a 2x4? Will I be screwing them together?
                      197133' Chris Craft Coho/Catalina Sedan, twin CC 327QA's, Paragon V drives. Restoration in progress1985 Bayliner Capri 1952 (19' cuddy),OMC 3.0L. Restored with the knowledge here on iBoats'70 (circa) Amphicat 6x6 AATV, future Coho tender'87 Kawasaki 650SX, '90

                      Tow rig: '74 Buick LeSabre Luxus convertible 455ci cude U 4BBL factory dual exhaust

                      Comment



                      • #41
                        Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                        14 you can use what ever combination to get to the size you want.....2x 3/4 with a half inch shoved between......or whatever you choose.

                        you can use stainless screws to hold them togeather....but i like to laminate with poly and matt....

                        search laminating there is several different ways......erik greens unintentional stringer job is a fantastic toturial of what he did....he used a cabosil wood flour peanut butter mix......his job is first class
                        The Hull Extension Thread
                        great info on all aspects on boat building with detailed information.

                        http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=234392

                        IN MEMORY OF Our friend SpinnerBait_Nut LESTER WRIGHT July 31, 1953 - Nov 26, 2008 RIP

                        IN MEMORY OF Our friend Tashasdaddy Robert (bob) Griffis. October 27, 1948
                        November 29 2010 RIP

                        Comment



                        • #42
                          Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                          As far as support goes u need to keep the shape of the hull stable when removing/installing stringers, if on the trailer, you could block it where ever possible. if not i might suggest building a cradle out of demension lumber that fits the hull length wise and laterally before removing stringers. When building our new boats we use regular kiln dried lumber for the stingers, the difference is we "hot coat them first" meaning coating with resin after being scribed to fit and let them cure. then they are beaded in hull and deck putty before lamination to the hull. Hull and deck putty is resin milled fiberglass witha like bit of glass bubble(cabosil) miked together, using a rounded putty knife to shape a radius so the glass with bend without leaving an air pocket. Any holes put in the stringers during installation of other parts (ie engine) are sealed. This is what we do with everything form the 22 footer to the 65 footer

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                          • #43
                            Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                            I love the discussion of PT vs other plys. It is like the question of how many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie pop. I must say from my little experience, I placed a PT deck with no protection onto an aluminum boat and now I am replacing everything the aluminum seems alright and the underside of the deck looks good. That was 15 years ago and the boat has been sitting uncovered under an oak tree for 10 years. Now I am replacing with PT and covering in fiber resin hoping it will last longer.
                            1965 20' Texas Maid Electra

                            http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=261511

                            sigpic

                            Comment



                            • #44
                              Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                              So, like "kiln dried" lumber you used as stringers...that could be a common 2x4 wall stud? "Hot coating" before installing them seems like a good idea.

                              "Dimensional" lumber is like a common 2x4 stud versus plywood, right? Sorry I'm not familiar with the term.

                              I know there's a lot of right ways I can go with this project, I just don't want to go a bad way.

                              Would I be okay using something kiln dried for the stringers or should I go with laminating plywood to make my own engineered beam?

                              And, you guys suppose that supporting the hull in this fashion would be okay? Excuse my not to scale, exaggerated drawing lol

                              197133' Chris Craft Coho/Catalina Sedan, twin CC 327QA's, Paragon V drives. Restoration in progress1985 Bayliner Capri 1952 (19' cuddy),OMC 3.0L. Restored with the knowledge here on iBoats'70 (circa) Amphicat 6x6 AATV, future Coho tender'87 Kawasaki 650SX, '90

                              Tow rig: '74 Buick LeSabre Luxus convertible 455ci cude U 4BBL factory dual exhaust

                              Comment



                              • #45
                                Re: Replacing Bayliner cuddy flooring

                                it would be dest if u can support the boat right under the existing stringers. As you begin to pull the stringers out check to make sure the hull isnt moving by measureing from a fixed point to the bottom of the hull in several places.

                                Laminating your own stringers is fine also. Just remember to hot coat everything before laminating them together. If you know someone with a vaccuum bag, that would be a great way to laminate them together.

                                If not screws and clamps work. You can always take the screws back out after laminating them together and fill the holes before installation as well.

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