Popular Mechanics 1962 PM38 Build [SPLASHED 2017]

[kcassells]

PEK,
I believe Wood was in his gentlemanly way saying not to use the product for this application. Too much great work going on here to have that material fail after you've completed the boat.
JMHO,
KC

 

[pekstrom]

I've been researching the Flex n' Fill filler and Personally I think it might be a bit questionable in this application. I can't and am not speaking from experience but the marine environment is so much different than other forms of construction that I'd probably stick to the tried and true marine wood fillers which are typically resin based products. I'll be VERY interested in the long term effectiveness of it sooo make sure once she's been on the water for a while you report back on how she's holding up.

Ok, do you have any additional details you can share? I fully admit this was a bit of an impulse thing as it seemed ok on paper, and since the plans weren't real specific. I agree the marine environment is quite different so while some things not meant for marine use may still work, others are just not suitable.

Would you have some marine fillers you have had good experience with and would recommend that I could look for? I guess I could just get some filler for my epoxy and use that if I decided to give up on the flex-n-fill?

 

[pekstrom]

PEK,
I believe Wood was in his gentlemanly way saying not to use the product for this application. Too much great work going on here to have that material fail after you've completed the boat.
JMHO,
KC

Yeah, I believe you are correct. :lol:

 

[gm280]

Ok, do you have any additional details you can share? I fully admit this was a bit of an impulse thing as it seemed ok on paper, and since the plans weren't real specific. I agree the marine environment is quite different so while some things not meant for marine use may still work, others are just not suitable.

Would you have some marine fillers you have had good experience with and would recommend that I could look for? I guess I could just get some filler for my epoxy and use that if I decided to give up on the flex-n-fill?

peckstrom, you have built a really nice boat that we all have been following with great interest. I would remove that stuff and replace with some marine quality filler and know your efforts are going to last. I don't think anybody watching your boat project wants to see it compromised at this point. There are some great marine fillers you could use. Some are going to be harder then others to feather out. But there will make your project that much more sound and water tight. I lean towards polyester type filers that would be two part. But maybe others have better easier ideas and will suggest some. JMHO

 

[pekstrom]

peckstrom, you have built a really nice boat that we all have been following with great interest. I would remove that stuff and replace with some marine quality filler and know your efforts are going to last. I don't think anybody watching your boat project wants to see it compromised at this point. There are some great marine fillers you could use. Some are going to be harder then others to feather out. But there will make your project that much more sound and water tight. I lean towards polyester type filers that would be two part. But maybe others have better easier ideas and will suggest some. JMHO

Thank you very much for the kind words! I will chalk this up as a mistake and will put some elbow grease in to remove what I have so far. I'll also look around for marine fillers and will see what I find. If anyone knows of a good product they can recommend by all means please chime in.

Actually, perhaps a silly question but for smoothing out the sides to hide the fiber glass strips covering the joints and screws, should I be looking for a filler or would I need a fairing compound?

 

[Scott Danforth]

I would be looking at a micro-balloon fairing material.

 

[gm280]

Pekstrom, I don't know how much Polyester or Epoxy Resin you have left. But you could mix up your own fairing compound is you have enough Polyester or Epoxy Resin remaining. They make fillers for either polyester or epoxy that will thicken the resins so you can fill in things with it. I use Polyester Resin, Cabosil and Glass Bubbles, but I am certain Epoxy Resins would suffice as well. Epoxy would use Micro Balloons and Cabosil to thicken the resin to make filler material. So check to see what you have and report back. You may have enough to do this without buying anything else. Those mixtures would certainly fill in any area and be water proof perfectly too. :noidea:

 

[pekstrom]

Pekstrom, I don't know how much Polyester or Epoxy Resin you have left. But you could mix up your own fairing compound is you have enough Polyester or Epoxy Resin remaining. They make fillers for either polyester or epoxy that will thicken the resins so you can fill in things with it. I use Polyester Resin, Cabosil and Glass Bubbles, but I am certain Epoxy Resins would suffice as well. Epoxy would use Micro Balloons and Cabosil to thicken the resin to make filler material. So check to see what you have and report back. You may have enough to do this without buying anything else. Those mixtures would certainly fill in any area and be water proof perfectly too. :noidea:

I will check, but I believe I have around half a gallon of resin left. I do need to do one last coat of the bottom though... I could get some more epoxy if I need to. I did find .5 gallons of micro-spheres and also a silica thickener that I'll probably go ahead and get. That should get me started. It seems the thickener helps prevent sagging on vertical or near vertical surfaces so I'm sure I'll need some on the sides.

 

[Ned L]

I will agree with WOG here............

As one option I have used "Total Boat Fairing Compound", I'm sure there are lots of other similar products.
It is vailable from the same place that you got your epoxy I believe. It is epoxy based and made for just this purpose. It can be spread very thin (to fill the last of the weave of the cloth), or heavier (to fill screw holes). it is an easy 50/50 mix and changes color as you mix it for a visual cue that it is completely mixed. It sands very easily when cured, so it's not like trying to sand a solid epoxy surface.
I bought the smallest kit and had probably 1/3 left over after fairing the trunk cabin top on my boat (about 7 1/2 ft x 9 ft).

 

[pekstrom]

I will agree with WOG here............

As one option I have used "Total Boat Fairing Compound", I'm sure there are lots of other similar products.
It is vailable from the same place that you got your epoxy I believe. It is epoxy based and made for just this purpose. It can be spread very thin (to fill the last of the weave of the cloth), or heavier (to fill screw holes). it is an easy 50/50 mix and changes color as you mix it for a visual cue that it is completely mixed. It sands very easily when cured, so it's not like trying to sand a solid epoxy surface.
I bought the smallest kit and had probably 1/3 left over after fairing the trunk cabin top on my boat (about 7 1/2 ft x 9 ft).

Oh! Even better! Somehow I had missed this one. If I just wanted to use it on the sides between the sheer and spray rails I may be able to get away with the smaller kit as well. I really liked their epoxy system so far. It worked very well for me. I could get a small amount of micro-spheres to mix in my epoxy for other, smaller areas. Thanks!

 

[gm280]

pekstrom, I can't say for certain, but 5 gallons of micro balloons is a lot of filler. I would first look at WOG and Ned L's suggestions first. Could be an easier application and sanding effort. :noidea:

Maybe WOG can come on here and explain his method better with instructions to explain what to use. :thumb:

 

[Ned L]

Here is what the 'Total boat' product looks like after sanding. It's the light green stuff. You want to use a pretty big stiff sanding block so that you take material off the high spots but not from the low spots.

 

[pekstrom]

pekstrom, I can't say for certain, but 5 gallons of micro balloons is a lot of filler. I would first look at WOG and Ned L's suggestions first. Could be an easier application and sanding effort. :noidea:

Maybe WOG can come on here and explain his method better with instructions to explain what to use. :thumb:

Oh, no, I had a period in front for half a gallon. 5 gallons would be way more than I would need. :lol:

I actually went ahead and ordered that Total Boat product since I have used their epoxy on the boat and it has worked very well. Now I just have to get that white stuff off of the bottom. I know what I'll be doing this weekend. :joyous:

 

[gm280]

Oh, no, I had a period in front for half a gallon. 5 gallons would be way more than I would need. :lol:

I actually went ahead and ordered that Total Boat product since I have used their epoxy on the boat and it has worked very well. Now I just have to get that white stuff off of the bottom. I know what I'll be doing this weekend. :joyous:

:sorry: pekstrom. I now see that DOT. I skimmed over it the first time and thought WOW, that is a lot of micro-spheres. I guess I need to get some glasses as well as hearing aids. Getting old does seem to have some issues to deal with. But I guess it beats the alternative. :facepalm:

 

[Woodonglass]

Yup, the Total Boat filler is basically Epoxy resin with Micro Balloons mixed in. Mixed to the consistency of Ketchup.
Sold by the pound and 2lbs should be ample. Very light weight material. For 1 quart of resin you'll use approcimately 1 1/2 qts of the ballons and they would only weigh a few ozs. Kinda like talcum powder.

[SIZE=-1]Phenolic Microballoons (BJO-0930) These red/purple color phenolic spheres when mixed with epoxy resins will create a low density paste compound which will sand easily and improve strength/flexibility of the cured resin. Better for large gap filling.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]FL-PH010[/SIZE]

 

[pekstrom]

This is great! I am learning all kinds of stuff here. Thank you all!

 

[Willyclay]

We all are. Good luck!

 

[Reechard]

Wow what great work, came here from the day boats page as well, looking for inspiration and people who have made the pm 38 before.

Will be keeping up with the rest of your build and probably ask some questions as I'm starting my build.
My boss just got me into boats and I'm now starting the build.

 

[pekstrom]

Wow what great work, came here from the day boats page as well, looking for inspiration and people who have made the pm 38 before.

Will be keeping up with the rest of your build and probably ask some questions as I'm starting my build.
My boss just got me into boats and I'm now starting the build.

Hi Reechard and welcome aboard. Thank you for the kind words. It's been a fun and very educational experience so far. And everyone here on this forum has been very helpful. I have learned a lot. So you are also going to build a PM38? That's great! I have been contacted by a few others who are also going to build one. It really seems like a great little boat. Of course it remains to be seen how she behaves on the water, but I'm hopeful.

 

[pekstrom]

Something completely different for a moment. Had to work last night from about 10pm until about 4am this morning. Had to update some firmware in several servers at work. Today I got to sleep in a bit and I was going to enjoy a day of relaxation and boat work. Well, that didn't happen. Found out we had a water leak somewhere in the house and eventually found that the pressure release valve on the water heater didn't close properly. I wasn't able to get it to work so had to replace it. Did check the water pressure to make sure it wasn't too high. Then the wife pointed out the faucet in the kitchen was dripping so had to figure out the cartridge I needed and replace it. Not exactly how I had planned on spending the day off. I had actually planned to start working on getting that white stuff off the side of the boat. Guess it will have to wait until the weekend, which thankfully isn't too far off. Just one of those days...