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Thread: Rub rail ends?

  1. #1
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    Default Rub rail ends?

    I've been redoing a 19 62/63 Duratech Sportboat and am in need of one front rub rail end cap.
    If anyone has on they'd like to sell let me know.


    I'm also interested in any pics of any Sportboats out there.

  2. #2
    Petty Officer 1st Class JoeMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    The Sportboat model first appeared in 1964. What is the 5 digit serial on your boat? This will allow us to date the year for you, as well as provide specs, based on the exact model you've got. That will be stamped on your ID tag as well.

    Have you visited the Duratech site? There is a very nice Sportboat in our gallery, but the owner will be sending a 'larger' picture of it...since it's not large enough to see detail. I've got some 'junker' Sportboat pics too. www.duratechboats.com

    I'll share some brochure info once we know which one you've got, along with the age.

    Can you post a pic or two of yours here?
    JoeMan
    1964 Duratech Neptune

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    Petty Officer 1st Class JoeMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    Here is Tim's. Needs interior restoration, but the exterior is in nice shape. This one was made after Penn Yan acquired Duratech; thus the lap strake hull.

    JoeMan
    1964 Duratech Neptune

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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    I really can't say for sure what year mine is, there is no hull number on it, at least not one that's readable. There's a tag on the splashwell forward, port side panel with some numbers and the Duracraft address but the numbers are worn away, they had a fire extinguisher mounted there and the bottom of the extinguisher rubbed most of the numbers off the tag.

    The boat is smooth sided, has a midway belt rail like the one above, which is what I need the end caps for, and has some sort of vinyl over aluminum on the top sides. It's been painted over but still looks decent. The floor was well rotted and the foam beneath the deck was saturated with water. It came from up in NY somewhere back in 1989, thus the 1989 home made title it has. NJ just assigned it a number and it became what ever year boat that was done, which was apparently 1989. I had figured on 1963 because it was the earliest registration I found in the boat, registered to the same name who I bought the boat from. (I got it from the original owners wife after he passed away. It had a makeshift side console rigged in it, all new cables and a motor with a brand new power head installed, the tools, old power head, and factory parts boxes were all still in the boat. I take it that he for whatever reason all of a sudden just stopped working on the boat many years ago and it sat in a barn. The barn roof was leaky and the boat got wet in later years. Surprisingly the forward deck is still perfect but I plan to replace it all at the same time.

    The older registration cards I found also list it as a homemade 17' boat, with an assigned NY hin number.

  5. #5
    Petty Officer 1st Class JoeMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    Are you saying your boat has the same one-piece spray rail (the rail running along the lower part of the hull which directs the water spray away from the boat) as the Sportboat above? That helps with the dating. If your boat had the "split" spray rail like the Comanches have (in the Comanche thread), then it would be a 1964. '64 is the first year the Sportboat was made. If your Sportboat has the one piece spray rail and has the smooth hull panels, that makes it a 1965. Lap strake sides and one piece spray rail make it 1966 - 68.
    JoeMan
    1964 Duratech Neptune

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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    Yes, the spray rail on mine is one continuous piece on each side, it runs about 2" from the breast plate to about 3" from the transom. The sides are smooth, and the spray rail has a white rubber strip in the center. I'm missing one front end cap.

    This thing is built like a tank, the hull has to weight in at nearly 800 lbs or so, the hull is made from light plate aluminum not light sheet metal like other aluminum boats I've seen. The transom metal is nearly 1/8" thick. There is no flex in the sides of this boat, if you punched it, you would most likely break your hand before denting it.

    I did notice that the bow on mine is much more rounded and more flared than the one shown above, it doesn't come to a point along the rub rail, it sort of rounds out a bit more. It's also wider in the bow than in the stern by about a foot.

    Also, the strakes under neath on mine run full length and there are 4 plus the keel strip. They run from about 4" from the transom to the point where the hull begins to rise, which is a riveted seam in the lower hull as well. This is about the point where the second from the last handrail mounts are from the rear.

    Overall, this thing is built like it was meant to go into battle not carry the family out on the river. I can't believe I don't see more of these, I think the only other Duratech I've run across has been a small row boat.

    Something I was thinking of doing is to replace the original floor cross members which were 2x2" wood, with aluminum 2x2 tubing, this would make for one less thing to rot away.
    I've also considered doing it as a stick steer boat with a completely open deck and removable pedestal drivers seat and fold down rear bench for passengers. Sort of a more is less approach I guess, but also to save weight. I intend to use it for river fishing, mostly with two guys but I want to be able to carry two passengers if needed as well. I'd also like to find a way to seat them further forward than that fold down bench in the rear. Which is shot anyhow.

    I have two motors to choose from here, either a 1986 Johnson 70hp, or a 2005 Tohatsu 50hp two stroke, or just leave the vintage 40hp on it, but I'm afraid it won't be enough for boat this size. The old big twin just don't seem like enough motor for a 17' boat this heavy?

  7. #7
    Petty Officer 1st Class JoeMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    In the 3 years we've had the www.duratechboats.com website in place, we've heard from about 250 owners. This number continues to increase. Keep in mind...once someone uses and appreciates a Duratech, they're most often not selling it unless they need to...so there are not a slew of "new" owners popping up looking for info. With no website for many years, they're gradually trickling in. :-) That said...there are a lot of active Duratechs in our gallery...currently owned and operated...take a peek sometime if you have not yet.

    As for built like a tank - yes sir. My Neptune runabout was made in '64...same structural aluminum as yours...crazy tough. Agreed, I'd break a knuckle if I punched it. One duratech owner said that his boat seems to have been made tough enough to cut through ice.

    I agree about the cross members. In fact, I'm not sure of the year...but it may be just later than yours...but a Duratech owner sent me a picture of the structure underneath his wood floor. The front to back box stringers were aluminum, and the side to side cross members on top of those were aluminum as well! So your idea is right on. Roy Moss had that idea back in the day as well!

    Specs for your boat are below. You can hang an 85 horse on there. I sure would!

    JoeMan
    1964 Duratech Neptune

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    Petty Officer 1st Class JoeMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    Hows about a couple pictures of your Sportboat? I'm sure she's not pretty right now...that's ok.
    JoeMan
    1964 Duratech Neptune

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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    Right now she's covered up in tarps for the winter, and their covered in snow. I built a frame inside out of PVC to support the tarp, and shrink wrapped over the tarp.

    The specs that I can read on my original plate read don't match the specs you show above?
    My total length is 17' 2", measured from the tip of the bow rub rail cap, to the top rear edge of the transom down the straight center line of the boat. The tag reads only Max HP 80 and 1870 lbs max weight/8 persons.
    Without weighing this thing, I can't really say on the actual weight but in its stripped down state, I still can't budge this thing on the trailer. I can lift the bow or stern on my 18' Starcraft Starchief, which weighs in at like 900lbs dry. I'd guess this as being heavier. I'd have figured this in the 1,000lb range just in aluminum weight. I'll look to see if I have a pic from before of this boat. (There's also another one of these around here somewhere, its painted red and white, I passed it on the road about 5 months ago looking like it just came out of a barn too.

    The funniest part about this boat is that people who don't know what it is assume its fiberglass till they get up close. I had one guy knock on my door a while back wanting to know if I wanted to sell my Mako 17 out back, I do see some resemblance but I don't see how it looks like an old Mako.

    They apparently did make a lot of changes when Penn Yan took over, the newer boats hardly look the same. Not just the lapstrake sides but the bow flare and flowing lines are gone.
    Did the keep the stepped floor in the later years? (Mine has an 8" or so step up in the deck about mid ship).

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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    I found this pic on my computer here, It was taken right after I took it off the trailer it came on last summer. To give you an idea of it's width, that trailer has about 68" between the fenders.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  11. #11
    Petty Officer 1st Class JoeMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    Interesting. I've just gone through every single brochure I have on the Sportboat. FYI, there also was a "Super Sportboat", but this was 18 feet 1, built on the Galaxy hull with an engine max of 100hp. Yours being a 17 footer is definitely built on the 17' Orion hull.

    I'm not so concerned about the 5 inch difference in the LOA measurement...you and the Duratech guy simply didn't measure from the exact same spot, or something. My measurement does not exactly match the specs I see for the '64 Neptune either. The max engine of 80 hp on your tag vs. 85 hp...that's odd, since all standard Sportboat literature says 85 is max. Capacity is always shown as 1,640. Weight is shown as 575 or 600. Not sure why yours seems so heavy on the trailer. Possible that your bunkers extend further back to the stern, where you'd actually have a considerably heavier nose weight than if the bunkers did not extend all the way to the stern? Just a thought. Or, did Duratech weigh the empty hull prior to dressing it...putting in the flooring, etc? Don't know.

    From what I see, the stepped up floor looks to have been there right along in the Sportboat.

    And yes...when Penn-Yan bought Duratech in '65 and then came out with their own version of the Sportboat, the lapstrake design definitely did not follow the same lines...they just did it their way. It's the same with the other models as well...the smooth panel hulls are more bubbled out, the lap strake have a different shape. My guess is the Penn Yan built boats rode a bit different. My boat rides like a dream and spanks the chop.

    With my Neptune, the smooth panels have also fooled a few guys, asking me if she's fiberglass...to which I smile and say nope...aluminum. I'd not trade this beast for an equivalent glass boat either.

    Looking forward to more pics when weather allows.
    JoeMan
    1964 Duratech Neptune

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    Default Re: Rub rail ends?

    The closest I can come to their measurement in length is to measure from the tip of the bow, not counting the rub rail, and to bottom corner of the transom wall inside. This gives me 16' 9-1/8" I did this by standing two poles up next to the boat and leveling and squaring them up with the hull. The weight is pretty simple, it's just plain heavy. It sits pretty evenly on the roller trailer, the forward rollers actually contact the hull much further forward than the bunks on the old trailer did. The trailer it was on was a combination of roller bunks and wood bunks with a series of quad roller assemblies down the keel.

    What surprised me was that it still felt so heavy after pulling out all the wet foam. I pulled out about 10 trash barrels of wet polystyrene that weighed roughly 40 lbs per cubic foot of foam. ( intentionally measured and weighed out one block of foam that measured 6" thick, 6" wide and 24" long weighed in at 45 lbs 3 oz. The center three sections of the boat was stacked full with these chunks of foam. Most were in varied lengths and the outer sections were tapered to fit the space between the hull and deck. The result was a boat that weighed more than my small truck would easily pull. I started stripping the floor out with a rake, the rear wood was so rotted most of it came out using a bent pitch fork. The foam was another story, I was breaking it up and tossing it into another trash drum, the result was a drum that was unmovable when it was full. I ended up bagging the foam and mixing it with regular trash a little at a time over the course of a few months to get rid of it. It was just too heavy to toss out all at once. I did lighten some of it by running it over with my tractor and trying to squeeze out the water. it also allowed it to take up less room. I figured I took out over 1500 pounds of wet foam in all, I was shocked when I added it all up. I knew it was heavy but would have never guessed it to be three quarters of a ton of water weight. The forward deck was in good shape with only a few soft corners so it will be used for templates if the deck does indeed end up being the exact same height after adding the aluminum cross members.
    I feel that with the aluminum cross members the deck could be replaced much easier next time. I'd also like to figure out a better control set up than the jury rigged side console it's got. It would be nice to keep an completely open deck which could be pulled up without removing a console or any cables or wiring. I'm also not a fan of having all the cables burried under the deck in the bilge area. I think a stick steer is the right answer for this and then a couple of removable pedestal seats. The fold down jump seat and side console in the newer brochure would put me off to one side and thus unbalance the boat if running alone.

    Besides, with the larger 70 hp Johnson motor and me being seated at the bow at the controls I think it would balance out better. I could also then built the rear deck with a compartment for a semi permanent fuel tank just aft of mid ship.

    I'll make my final layout decision once I get all the aluminum cross members in place and see where the new deck will fall. I think that I could also fit a fuel tank up in the forward floor area but I'm not sure I'd want the 15 gallons of fuel and weight with me up in the bow. If I did a center console then I'd consider doing that, or maybe putting the tank under the console up front, and the drivers seating position just behind the step in the floor. The only issue I see with that is that the steering and control cables would have to pass through the aluminum bulkhead panel which separates the two levels of the deck.

    I'll most likely add sheet foam for flotation, but am also looking at maybe some sort of trapped air idea, along the lines of soda bottles or sealed PVC tubes. I do know that what ever goes back in it needs to be water proof and not as likely to water log as the original foam did.

    The theory of them weighing these boats prior to the deck being installed is a possibility but mine right now is a bare hull, no deck, no foam, no motor, no fuel tank, only the 20" x15" wide 1 1/2" plywood panel in the transom. The rest is all aluminum hull and structure.
    From a fabricators view I look at the hull this way, it's roughly comprised of about 7 sheets worth of aluminum if we were using 5x12' aluminum sheets, if the aluminum at hand was .125" thick that would make each sheet 108lbs, then there's the rub rails, splash rails, 5 structural aluminum stringers, deck brackets, and mid ship bulkhead panel, plus all the 3/16" x 18" or so support brackets that stiffen the gunwales on the inside, and several aluminum supports under the bow section. I can see where this hull can be near 1,000 lbs. I don't get the 575 lb weight they give unless that was for the Penn Yan version?
    I'd venture to guess that each stringer if removed would weigh in at nearly 40+ lbs each full length. They are much thicker than the hull material or the upper sections. Then you have to take into account the four strakes, the extra heavy duty breast plate on the bow, and the keel strip that caps the keel seam on the outside as well. These parts all add weight, an although they don't weight much individually they add up fast. I'd guess the actual weight at somewhere in the 950 to 1,000 lbs minus the deck wood, motor, and any liquids.
    Maybe once the snow is gone and I get back to work on it I'll haul it over to the CAT scales and get a weight on it. I know the trailer weighs in at 710 lbs according to the ID tag.
    (GVWR - capacity= actuall trailer weight). The trailer's GVWR is 3110 lbs and the capacity is listed at 2400 lbs. That gives me the weight of the trailer.

    What are the chances of finding an end cap for my splash rail?

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